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Who is Bashir Ahmad Orchard? The first Irish-Ahmadi Mullah

Intro
We have written about this mullah before.  As soon as he died, Ahmadiyya INC seems to have hired Noonan as a replacement.  In the below, we have posted his conversion story.

The data
http://whyahmadi.org/converts-accounts/account-of-bashir-ahmad-orchard.html

Account of Bashir Ahmad Orchard

Bashir-Ahmad-OrchardTorquay is a delightful holiday resort on the south coast of Devon and it was there that I first saw the light of the day on 26th April 1920. My father was a doctor and my mother had been a nurse prior to her marriage. Class distinction existed more than it does today. My parents belonged to the upper middle class. My paternal grandfather had also been a doctor while my mother’s father was an admiral. The only grandparent I knew was my maternal grandmother and she died while I was still a young boy.

I had two elder brothers but no sisters. The eldest, who was three years older than me, met an untimely death during the Second World War when the battleship on which he served was sunk in the Mediterranean by enemy action. My other brother, who was inclined towards religion from a young age (and is now a Roman Catholic Priest), was at middle age, a Protestant priest in the Church of England, but subsequently had to quit his vocation. He took up teaching as a profession in a school. He again had the urge to priesthood in the Roman Catholic Church. My mother also became a Roman Catholic soon after my brother’s conversion. She was a very religious lady all her life and regularly attended church. My father, however, was little interested in religion. One of my maternal aunts had been a missionary in china for forty years and had much to do in helping my brother first become a priest in the Church of England.

When I was three years old my father bought a house situated on a hill overlooking Torbay. It was on the fringe of the countryside at a point called Barton Cross. I used to love to roam the fields and woods also to find my way to the many beaches, which were not so very far away. I enjoyed gathering wild fruits and nuts. When in season, I used to get up in the early hours of the morning and search the fields for mushrooms before other people appeared on the scene for the same purpose. Those days remain with me as living memories.

My brothers and I went to Winchester Lodge Preparatory School. The headmaster was a keen cricketer who played for Wiltshire. I was in both the cricket and football teams. One by one we left the school, as we grew older and moved on to Monkton Combe, which is the name of a well-known public school on the outskirts of Bath. I never enjoyed school nor was a bright pupil. I left school at the age of sixteen without any kind of educational certificate. Once I expressed my desire to become a doctor and I thought my father would be pleased that I wanted to follow in his footsteps. He promptly rebuffed me and told me I could never become a doctor because I lacked the aptitude for diligent study.

I left school at the end of the summer term in 1936. During that last term my mother had been granted legal separation from my father and had taken up temporary residence in Bath. Later she settled in Bristol. I was at a loose end and for nothing better to do I joined the army although I was far below eighteen, which was the required minimum age. My regiment was the Somerset Light Infantry and my pay was two shillings (ten pence) a day. Life was tough and I did not find congenial companionship as I had been brought up in a more cultured society. I had signed up for seven years, but at the end of my second year, I wrote to my father requesting him to purchase my discharge, which was the only way of terminating my service. He promptly sent me a cheque for thirty-five pounds and within a few days I was back with my mother.

It appears that I still had some attachment for army life as I soon joined a Territorial Unit of the Royal Army Medical Corps. Territorials were part-time soldiers who normally did not have to train for more than one evening a week.

War clouds were looming on the horizon and on 3rd September 1939, Britain declared war on Germany. My unit was immediately mobilized and once again I was a full-time soldier. We were sent to France and later moved up into Belgium. The German offensive pushed us back to the beaches of Dunkirk from where the battered remnants of the British Expeditionary Force were evacuated back across the English Channel to their homeland. I remember boarding a boat crowded to capacity with dishevelled and weary troops. Almost immediately I fell asleep and when I awoke the boat was entering Dover harbour. Relief organisations were waiting to distribute tea and refreshments after which we were dispatched by train to a destination in Wales where, as heroes and not as prisoners, we were billeted in the cells of a local prison.

In 1941, I applied for a commission in the Indian army. I had to present myself before several interviewing boards and finally I was accepted as an officer cadet and sailed for India in 1942 with a contingent of other cadets. The ship was one in a large convoy, which took two months to reach Bombay. Our final destination was Bangalore where we underwent a six months’ course of training before being posted to our regiments as second lieutenants. I joined the 17th Dogra Regiment, which was stationed as Jullundur. Later was transferred to the Indian Army Ordnance Corps. I spent considerable time on active service in Assam and Burma. Perhaps one of my most memorable experiences was the siege of Kohima in the Manipur hills close to the Assam-Burma border. I was one of a motley force congregated on a wooden hill and completely surrounded by the invading Japanese. We were subjected to bombardment and attack for two weeks until reinforcements eventually broke through and relieved us. Supplies were dropped to us by parachute. On one occasion, in particular, I was very fortunate not to lose my life. We were in the trenches. A senior officer called me away from my position for a few minutes. During that brief period a shell landed in the trench on the spot, which I had just vacated. Two soldiers who had been near to me were killed.

The fore mentioned event took place in 1944, in which year deeper spiritual inclinations seemed to awaken within me. I was never much influenced by Christianity. I had become quite enchanted with Hindu literature and a close friend of mine was a Brahmin. As yet I had not been attracted in any way towards Islam although I did enjoy reading about the lives of the Moghul emperors in Glimpses of World History by Pandit Nehru.

Right up to that time my enjoyment in life was more or less the same as most young men. At sixteen I had become a regular drinker and smoker. Gambling was in my blood. When I was eighteen I had a temporary craze for dancing and, of course, I enjoyed going to the cinema and theatre. Although smoking is not specifically forbidden in Islam and may be considered a lesser vice, it was the hardest of them all for me to overcome. Nevertheless the physical and spiritual benefits gained from discarding that obnoxious habit have been immense.

My unit was camped near Imphal, which was a frontier outpost close to the Burma border. An Ahmadi sergeant who was also serving in my unit concluded, for reasons best known to himself, that I might be a person to whom he could introduce the message of Islam. His name was Abdul Rahman Dehlvi. There were also a number of other Britishers attached to the same unit, but as far as I know, he never approached any of them. Naturally he had to exercise diplomacy in view of the fact that I was commissioned officer with whom it would not be normal to discuss or propagate freely his religion. He arranged for a copy of the ‘Philosophy of the Teachings of Islam‘ by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad to be sent to me from Qadian.

My senses were exceedingly dull in those days and for this reason I found much of its contents hard to comprehend. Nevertheless parts of it inspired me and uplifted my spirits. Later on I deliberately left it on the reading table in the officers’ mess but I do not think anybody paid much attention to it. That was more than thirty-five years ago, during which time I have read it thirty to forty times and, like the hopeful batsman, I may score fifty sooner or later.

Two weeks leave were due to me and I was undecided where to go. Sergeant Abdul Rahman Dehlvi urged me to go and stay with one of his friends in Qadian, which was quite an unknown place to me and involved a long journey of approximately a thousand miles. A couple of days later I told him that I decided not to go. My pronouncement brought such a look of disappointment on his face that, merely out of sympathy for him, I immediately reversed my decision and promised to go for a few days.

Imphal lay about eighty miles from the nearest railway link at a jungle base called Manipur. The two places were connected by a long winding road that snaked up and down and round about a succession of jungle-clad hills. This was the first stage of my journey. It took me at least a week to reach Qadian, which I then came to know, was a small isolated town. Nobody was on the station to receive me as no one had been intimated the time of my arrival. I hired a horse vehicle and asked the driver to take me to the house of Mufti Mohammed Sadiq, which was the name of the person, with whom I was supposed to stay. I was jogged along a bumpy road and then through some narrow streets until the driver stopped by a door in a wall inside of which, some steps led to another door on the level of a roof courtyard. I knocked on the upper door. A chain jangled inside and the door was opened by a white bearded elderly gentleman stripped bare to the waist, no doubt on account of the hot weather. He was Mufti Sadiq. Both of us were surprised to see one another. I introduced myself and forthwith Mufti Sadiq instructed the horse vehicle to take me to the guesthouse, where I was accommodated in a sparsely furnished whitewashed room. Shortly afterward Mufti Sadiq came around to meet me. This time he was dressed in flowing robes and wore a magnificent headdress. Later I came to know that he was a companion of the Promised Messiah, Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmed, and also had been the first missionary to the United States of America.

Next day Mufti Sadiq escorted me around Qadian drawing my attention to various places of interest. I remember asking him on that occasion, what was the attitude of the Jama’at towards smoking? He replied, while it was not specifically forbidden, it was discouraged.

The highlight of my two-day visit was an audience with Hazrat Mirza Bashiruddin Mahmood Ahmad, the Khalifa and the supreme head of the Jama’at Ahmadiyya. This was a memorable event, although at that time I did not fully appreciate the significance of his spiritual status. He was seated on a chair on the verandah of his house. I do not remember the details of our conversation, though I do remember expressing my view that it was sufficient to follow the Ten Commandments in order to live a good life. His answer was to the effect that they were only some general principles which needed further clarification, such as the commandment ‘Thou shalt not kill’.

I was impressed most of all by his luminous countenance, which radiated an intangible spiritual light, which seemed to shine from his face and when he spoke, a charming smile animated his face. He was an embodiment of energetic repose, radiating physical, intellectual and spiritual magnetism, which captivated all within his presence. I realized that I was in the company of no ordinary person.

Generally I was impressed by everyone I met. This was what attracted me towards Islam more than anything else. My knowledge of Islam at that time was negligible, but I reasoned, that if these people were fruits of the faith, then it certainly had something to offer. I was in search of the truth and later I was to realize that I had found it in Qadian.

A notable event took place in my life in the evening after my departure. I was waiting on the station at Amritsar which is a town about thirty miles from Qadian. While waiting for my connection, I joined some other officers for drinks in the refreshment room. I was suddenly overcome with a feeling of aversion. The atmosphere seemed repulsive compared with the holy atmosphere of Qadian. There and then I resolved to forsake drinking once and for all. One of the first things I did when I rejoined my unit on the Burma front was to throw away all the bottles of alcohol I had in my possession.

The army was now on the offensive pushing deeper and deeper into Burma. The Japanese were in retreat and we reached a small town called Meiktilla. It was there that I made my decision to join Ahmadiyyat, the true Islam. I signed the Bai’at form and posted it to Qadian. That was, no doubt, the greatest step I had ever taken in my life.

I have already mentioned that I was shackled to both these vices (drinking and gambling).  Even on my historical visit to Qadian I carried a bottle of whisky and a bottle of rum in my luggage. Fortunately some higher power or my better judgment prevented me from taking drinks while I was there, although at that time, I did not consider drinking to be wrong in any way. I used to gamble on horses, greyhounds, dice and card games. Once when stationed at Imphal I lost a month’s pay gambling on cards with officers. These were the first two evils from which Islam rescued me.

Prior to my acceptance of Ahmadiyyat, I used to contribute nothing in the way of God or towards charity. Islam taught me the philosophy of giving in the way of Allah. Sacrificing what one loves for the sake of Allah wins the pleasure of Allah and earns one abundant reward. I commenced by paying one sixteenth of my income and later increased it to one tenth (Al-Wassiyat). Finally in 1967, I commenced paying one third and have been doing so ever since. Despite the fact that I enjoy only a meagre income, life is good to me in every respect. In addition to Zaka’at, I also regularly give Tahrik-i-Jadid and Ansar contributions, plus payments towards my Jubilee Fund promise and various other appeals.

Ahmadiyyat introduced into my life the regular observance of daily prayer which have proved a source of great blessing and comfort to me, testifying to the truth of the verse in the Holy Quran:

It is only in the remembrance of Allah that hearts can find comfort. (13:29)

I am still novice in the art of prayer. Prayer is more than a routine habit. I have gained much on the subject from the writings and discourses of the Promised Messiah may peace be upon him. They have been a source of inspiration to me.

Sometimes it is a matter of wonder to me how any Muslim, who is attached to Islam with a sincere heart, can intentionally fail to offer the prescribed prayers as commanded by Allah. Once when I was in Qadian shortly after my acceptance of Islam, an announcement by Hazrat Khalifatul Masih II appeared on a board outside Masjid-i-Mubarak, stating that if anyone during a period of ten years, knowingly and deliberately forsook even one prayer of the day, then he could not count himself as a true Ahmadi.

Everybody dreams. It is a normal function of the body. Investigators have ascertained that even animals dream. Since time immemorial, God has revealed Himself through the medium of dreams. The Holy Qur’an and earlier scriptures abound with incidents of people to whom God communicated knowledge, messages and future events through dreams. I do not recall the details of any dream before the time I accepted Ahmadiyyat. Since then, however, I have had many dreams, which I have never forgotten. Throughout the years they have remained with me as fresh and clear as at the time I received them.

I had no goals or ambition in life before I accepted Ahmadiyyat. I had no plans for the future. During the war I was a soldier due to compulsory service. I was more or less drifting through life like a capsized boat in the open sea. Yet when I was a very young child I was once gripped by a powerful yearning, which occurred one night when I was bed. I wanted to become and do something extraordinary. I did not want to pass through life being just one of the crowd. I wanted to be unique in one way or another. At that time I am sure I was not more than ten years of age at the most. I do not recall ever thinking or dwelling on the matter again. It was just like a flash of the moment, which never re-occurred but must have taken root in my subconscious mind from where later it was to emerge into reality. It would appear that this was brought about through my acceptance of Ahmadiyyat as the following events may suggest.

When the world war ended in 1945, I returned to England and was immediately demobilised. I went straight to my mother in Bristol where I stayed for a couple of days. I then travelled to London in search of the London Mosque where I introduced myself to the Imam Maulana J.D. Shams. I expressed my desire to work with the mission and also dedicate my life completely to the service of Islam. This event has been described by Maulana Shams:

After his release from the army, when he arrived in England, he stayed for two days only at Bristol with his relatives and so, on the third day, he was at the mosque in London. During his conversation with me he expressed his willingness to live at the mosque and become a Muslim missionary. I explained to him the responsibilities of a missionary and the required qualifications for missionary work. Eventually I promised him to see to his case sympathetically for missionary work and would write to him this matter. He was a little bit upset from my reluctance in accepting his offer readily. After a few days he, however, dedicated his life for the service of Islam unconditionally like other waqifeen. I sent his application to Hazrat Amir-ul-Momineen, with my opinion that he might be a useful missionary. I asked him to come and stay with us and to begin the study of Islam. Hazrat Amir-ul-Momineen graciously accepted his Waqf and Mr. Orchard began to work with other missionaries.
Review Of Religions, June 1947

Allah works in mysterious ways. He willed that this insignificant individual should become the first European Ahmadi Muslim missionary. This was, indeed, a singular favour, which Allah bestowed upon me. The following words of counsel were delivered to me by Hazrat Khalifatul Masih II:

At this time you are unknown, no doubt, and unheard of, but soon the time is coming when nations will feel proud of you and sing your praises. So mind, you do not take lightly what you say and what you do. Do not think that your movements are only personal, no, but they pertain to the whole British nation. The posterity will imitate your movements and follow them to the letter…if your movements and activities will be in accordance with Islam, and noble and grand, then they will be instrumental in raising the moral tone of your nation, but if they are below the mark and not in strict accordance with Islam, your nation will be the loser, thereby try therefore, to set a noble example for posterity, otherwise God will have another man to fulfill this task. When Ahmadiyyat will have spread all over the world, and spread it must, no power on earth can impede its destined progress, then there will be reverence for you in the hearts of the people, greater, than the one which they have for the greatest of the Prime Ministers.
Review of Religions, June 1947

Maulana-Bashir-Orchard-with-Hazrat-Khalifat-ul-Masih-IV

Maulana Bashir Orchard with Hazrat Khalifat ul Masih IV meeting Mr Montgomery Watt

I close this short review of my life with gratitude to Allah for his blessings and favours and with the declarations that all praise is due to Allah the Lord of all the worlds.

Mr Bashir Orchard served as a missionary in England between 1946 and 1952. He was then posted to Trinidad, West Indies from 1953. In 1957, he was recalled to Rabwah for an eight month refresher course, after which he was posted as a missionary to Guyana, South America. In 1966, he was transferred to Glasgow and remained there until 1983, when he was posted to Oxford, England.

In 1987, he was transferred to Islamabad, England, to concentrate on being Editor of a magazine called ‘Review of Religions’.

Mr Orchard has written several articles and books on Islam including ‘Life Supreme‘ and ‘Guideposts‘.

He would always take part in the Charity Walks and was determined to finish the walk, no matter what the distance was.

He passed away in 2002.  May Allah grant him the highest abode in heaven, Amen.

#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #ahmadiyyat #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #drsalam #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Sialkot #Mosqueattack

Noonan was interviewed in 2006–new data on this Mullah

Intro
Michael Peter Noonan aka Ibrahim Noonan is a terrible Mullah of Ahmadiyya INC.  He lies on behalf of Ahmadiyya every single day.

Related Essay’s
https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Noonan

Link to the older interview
http://www.socialaffairsunit.org.uk/blog/archives/000945.php

Data

Muslims in Galway: Jane Kelly meets Imam Ibrahim and hears how a good Catholic boy came to be a Muslim missionary seeking to convert Ireland to Islam

Posted by Jane Kelly

Michael Peter Noonan was born as one of seven children into a lower middle class Irish catholic family. He wanted to become a priest as a teenager. After losing his Catholic faith he became a night-club bouncer and body guard in London. Now he is Imam Ibrahim and wants to convert Ireland to Islam. Jane Kelly hears his story.

When Imam Ibrahim stands in the centre of Galway in his voluminous robes preaching the message of Islam, his main problem comes from other Muslims. There are over a thousand of them, immigrants from Iraq, Libya, Saudi and Algeria in what was until recently a quiet Irish town. He says:

I get abuse. They call me a Kaffir or infidel and say I should die.

He represents a reformist sect which orthodox Muslims dislike, but they are also a bit suspicious as he is in fact Irish. Ibrahim began life as plain Michael Peter Noonan, in Waterford. He is the only home-grown Irish Imam on the planet so far, and his conversion is surely a sign of the strange times in which we live.When I first visited Galway, in 1989, there were only three Muslims there. Dr Tasleem Amhed and Arshad Rashid had just arrived from Pakistan to start an Irish Jihad, a word then largely unknown in the west. They bought a five bedroomed house on a wind-blasted estate, and lived there with Rashid’s wife Zahide, who was hidden from Tasleem’s eyes behind a purdah curtain.

When Tasleem told me that it would be easy for him to convert the Irish to Islam I laughed like a banshee, picturing future renditions of “When Islamic Eyes are Smiling”, “Does Your Mother Come From Mecca?” and “Seven Sober Nights”.

But we’ve all drunk a lot of mineral water since then. Muslims have arrived en masse in Ireland, their leaders have grasped the proselytising power of TV, and astonishingly Islam is now seen by many as a viable replacement for 1500 years of Christian civilisation.

Ibrahim, 40, chatted to me recently in the same house over tea and delicious cakes made by his wife Qanita, 35, who lives behind the same curtain, now getting thin with age. In the background, MDM, a 24 hour Islamic TV channel shows an ancient white robed cleric preaching, and the room is full of box files, religious books, computer, photocopier and printer; all the paraphernalia of a modern missionary.

Ibrahim began life in simpler times as one of seven children in a lower middle-class family. His father Dennis was a builder, his mother Irene a hairdresser. Aged 12 he joined the Legion of Mary, practicing prayer and good works in the community. He did well academically and represented his school in athletics. At 18 he won a scholarship to Maynooth, Ireland’s most prestigious seminary, but in his late teens he changed his mind about becoming a priest. He says:

I worried about celibacy and questioned the divinity of Jesus.

He found the Church neither sacred nor practical enough.Having upset his family, he headed for London and to support himself, like the notorious Abu Hamsa, he worked as a night-club bouncer and body guard. During the day he protected the likes of the Sultan of Brunei and the Arsenal football team. At night he was a bouncer at Equinox, a flesh-pot on Leicester Square. He says:

I used to escort the models like Caprice and Elle McPherson into the VIP room. It was my job to stay with them.I saw people snorting cocaine and having sex. There were “Page Three” models who would do certain things – I won’t say what. There were wet t-shirt contests, and a lot of frolicking. I saw prostitutes, people trying to spike girls’ drinks and giving out ecstasy tablets. The bands I looked after were often high on heroin, they took it in front of me, they were so stupid and arrogant.

It was a dangerous and degrading job, dealing with people on drugs, out of control, not concerned about morals or God.

But it was his encounter with Barry Manilow which, perhaps understandably, finally pushed him into the arms of Allah. Ibrahim says:

I’d been a fan of his, but when I met him, perhaps he was having a bad day, but I found him bossy, arrogant and rude. I didn’t like the way he spoke to his co-stars in his show. I was very unhappy after that, he seemed to sum up the disappointment I felt about life and I decided to make a decision.

Islam with its authoritarian structure and dearth of fashionable crooners, was on offer and in 1995 he converted. For this sense of redemption and belonging, he was prepared to change everything. He had a house in Lewisham, a working wife and two small sons. Ibrahim says:

My interest in Islam destroyed the marriage. She liked night-clubs and the western way of life. I felt that I had normalised my life by becoming a Muslim, to me the Koran seemed rational, but she couldn’t see it. She refused to wear a veil or change her habits.

Three years ago, after learning Arabic, he returned to Ireland and agreed to marry a Pakistani he’d never met. She was chosen by the old man sermonising on the TV behind us. He says dispassionately, his mind fully focussed on his mission:

I trusted him and I trusted God. She’s a good wife and given me children.

Of his mission he says:

It will happen. Mohammed was told by God that Islam would rise in the West. I just need a small nucleus of Irish converts and they will bring other people in.

But did Mohammed mean as far west as Galway? While he talks two American Mormon missionaries who’ve come to the door also looking for converts, are invited in. Dressed in identical black anoraks they sit on the sofa smiling blankly. Beverages become an issue as they not only eschew alcohol like him, but can’t drink coffee or tea either. Sipping water, they nod at everything he says.The Mormons have 90 missionaries on the streets and made 125 converts in Galway last year, Ibrahim made two: Anna, 31, a Finn researching “holistic science”, and Christopher, now Yusuf Pender, 24, who studies film.

Yusuf discovered Islam through MDM, but is also bitterly disillusioned with Catholicism. He says in disgust:

It was dead even before the sex scandals, it’s about politics and power not spirituality.

His younger brother, Thomas, 22, is also thinking about converting.According to Galway Diocesan statistics, 95% of the population still have their babies baptised, but sitting among the Mormons and the Muslims I feel I have entered a new age of globalised Puritanism.

For these people the liberal agenda of their parents has failed, and Catholicism as it slackens its rigidities is not enough – they prefer the community of faith that howls at Ibrahim in the street.

Jane Kelly worked as a full time staff feature writer for the Daily Mail for 15 years, but she now lives as a freelance journalist and painter in west London. She is chiefly interested in writing about unusual, usually unpopular people.

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 Comments

Did you ever go across the sea to Ireland?
When the muzzein calls the faithful folk to pray,
As each unrolls his carpet, pointed southwards,
You hear the call to prayer on Gaaaalwaaaay Baaaaaaay.

Yes, it is almost irresistible.

Posted by: s masty at May 30, 2006 05:40 PM

•••

I feel a bit like Snoopy, shaking his fist at the Red Baron, since S.J.Masty came with his parody on a lovely old Irish song. I remember my father singing this (yes, I too am from that side of the water). The verse I particularly remember is:

For the strangers came and tried to teach us their ways
They scorned us just for being what we are
But they might as well go chasing after moonbeams
Or light a penny candle from a star

So it seems that certain strangers have now come to Erin, on a quest not so futile. But I can well see how Michael Peter Noonan came to follow that path. I came across the water when I was knee-high to a grasshopper, and had a C-of-E education, but Mr. Noonan’s misgivings about his Catholic education strike a strong chord with me about mine. Some years later, I made a lot of Arab friends, and found their culture so much more attractive than ours. Even in those days, among the student body, girls would be despised if they did and despised if they didn’t. I still think there is much to be said for the values of Muslim societies, even if these values are betrayed by hypocritical rogue males who do unspeakable things to women in the name of Islam. As it is written (Psalm 50, 16 and 21):

But unto the wicked God saith, What hast thou to do to declare my statutes, or that thou shouldest take my covenant in thy mouth?These things hast thou done, and I kept silence; thou thoughtest that I was altogether such an one as thyself: but I will reprove thee, and set them in order before thine eyes.

But then I found certain things that worried me deeply, for example, the statement that Jesus was NOT crucified. While the good teachings of Islam remain attractive, and Islamic philosophers such as Ibn Sina are head and shoulders above most of those of the West, there are discrepancies which make me wonder, what is its actual agenda? Is it to stop people becoming Christians?

Posted by: Robert H. Olley at May 31, 2006 07:11 PM

•••

I have read this article and was astonished at my findings. I would like to clarify a few points that have been above by Michael Noonan.

In regards to his statement about how our marriage ended due to the fact of my western way of life is fabrication. I am a born muslim and his reasons for conversion was so we could marry. I do not deny he then took on the religion above my marriage, I continued to wear a head scarf as my religon requests while we were married and there was no nightclubbing involved.

I am not want to respond to these type of accusations made like so many in the past, a lot of this information is inaccurate, but it was my older son who was searching for his father on the internet due to no contact in 10 years. They are very disapointed that their own father portrays no interest in his children’s lives yet he preaches Islam and I know Islam’s way is not to leave your children. My son has presented this and questioned me.

There is numerous things I have read in this post that are incorrect, like his middle name for a start, his career and his dates whether this has been made up by the interviewer or came from Michael it is misleading information to my children.

I know Michael (Ibrahim) is a devoted Muslim and is very passionate to Islam.

Posted by: Marina Ayaz at August 1, 2006 03:43 AM

•••

Salam ‘

This so called Journalist is a hack and an Islamophobe. This is a total misrepresentation of our conversation and most of it is made up. Iman Ibrahim is a very pios, intelegent Muslim (I know my spelling is crap) and gave that interview in good faith.

As for the comments his ex-wife made…well a day dosent pass when he dosent talk about his children but his wife wont let him see them becouse she is….well she is not telling the truth.

The Daily Mail is a racist brit paper with an anti Catholic & Anti-Islamic agenda. And his wife is not old… she is only 35….ageism..

So Byeeeeeee……….

Posted by: Yusuf Pender at September 3, 2007 03:03 PM

•••

For all those concernd, 90% of what is written in this article is not true, and blown out of porportion. I had Muslims friends long before I met my former wife, and had interest in Islam but I found True Islam in Ahmadiyyat and God works in his own ways to bring people to Him, and it may have happened through me meeting my former wife, but I accepted Islam for sake of God not because of marrage. I am not here to put blame on any one but she has said something which is not true, I have done every thing to see my childern and have asked her many times to allow me to see them them, my parent are proof of this, my former wife still has contact with them and my sons have been to my parents home, I love my sons more then I can explain with every heart beat I remember them. I have always shown respect towards my former wife because she the Mother of my Sons this is the teaching of Islam. I have spoken with Jane Kelly about what has been written and asked for it to removed. May the peace of almighty Allah be with you.

Ibrahim Noonan

Posted by: Ibrahim Michael Noonan at September 20, 2007 12:16 PM

•••

Hi there My name is John Noonan Mick’s younger brother and i would like to say for one my father was a roofer not a builder,what his ex wife has said is absolutly true, he actualy had to go on the run in london 4 months with my big sis marina, until he finally converted to Islam so he could marry i should i was at the wedding, he was never part of the Legion of Mary, because of my brothers obsessiveness with his religion i did not get to see my nephews for 6yrs until i finally contacted Marina and convinced her to come here to ireland to see her family, and know she has gone further because of him. Mick if ur reading this sorry but i will not let anyone say one thing about Marina and the lads especially a convert who calls himself Yusuf Pender who knows nothing of our family.

Posted by: John Noonan at November 17, 2007 06:20 PM

•••

My name is Marina and I am responding to my ex-husband’s post and my brother in-law John’s post:

Thank you for clarifying the above and verifying that most of the original post is incorrect as Michael made me look like a bad person.

I stopped Michael Noonan seeing the kids several years ago as he would never show up, I took him to court to make him see his kids and he was ordered to see them which he never stuck to and because of this I refused him access to visiting rights, which was my legal right.
However, since then I have allowed him on several occasions to make contact but he never has.
He has both of my son’s email addresses, my eldest son’s mobile number, our home address and our home telephone number but yet he has made no contact.
We lived 20 minutes apart for years but never once did he try to see his children. If someone took my kids off me I would camp outside their house just to get a glimpse and would fight till death.

He has not paid any money towards both of my son’s upkeep in 11 years. I am a single mother, with three jobs and work days and nights but yet not once has he given me any money in 11 years. No presents or even cards/letters. My eldest is going to Uni in a year to hopefully do a medical degree and I have to pay for this all by myself.
He is on low income because the Islamic community pay for his keep but he has not even applied for extra funds to support his two first born children which I know he can and then that payment should go to my children.
I am in constant contact with his family as I love them as my own, they have never done me or my children any wrong and I wish I had the money to visit them in Ireland. They are just like my parent’s and his brother’s and sister’s are my brother’s and sister’s!

Can I also add, my eldest son was once again searching for updates on his father on the Web and found this post again! – Contact your children Michael before it’s too late, not saying it’s not too late already. How sad that he has to search the Web to learn about you and look for recent pictures.

You obviously don’t want to financially support your sons, so at least pray for them!

Goodbye

Marina Ayaz

Posted by: Marina Ayaz at December 16, 2007 05:18 AM

•••

To Mr Yusef Pender,

You don’t know me and never will so please do not accuse me of lying – you have no right. Sadly you are mislead, lied to, lying or just a stupid fool.

PS: Humanely impossible for a day to pass without him mentioning his kids, even if you see him everyday.

PPS: Michael, please be honest and tell all if I have stopped you seeing the kids in the last 7 years at least? Then repent for lying. I have the proof.

Goodbye.

Posted by: Marina Ayaz at December 16, 2007 05:33 AM

•••

to all conerned, I could spend the whole day defending my self trying to proof that it was not I who stopped seeing my Son’s I have tried every thing, as far as my young brother John is concerned he is fully aware of every thing. through out this whole time I have not blamed any one and I am not going to start. If I could finance my sons I would, I was giving money every month but Marina wanted more and complaned to a goverment office, who assed my income and it was they who, informed me that according to my low income I was not at fault. I dont have my sons home address, or phone number, and once I sent a e-mail to my sons and an e-mail came back saying your sons dont have any desire to see you or contact you. I showed this to my parents who were shocked. the one time my eldest son contacted me his mother would come on the phone and try to create a problem between me and my Wife. If my sons want to come and visit me or speak to me they can do so. Salman and Osman I love both and there is not a day which I dont think about you your photos are with me all the time where I go. Salman if I could support you for your medical degree I would, but I am Proud of you and I always pray for your success in Life and also for Osman. “Truth is Truth and I am not Afraid of Truth because I walk in Truth and only He who is Truth knows the Truth” May the peace and blessing of God Almighty be with you and protect you my Sons Always.

your Dad.

ps Salman & Osman contact the Jamaat in Australia and they will help us make contact. Salman and Osman when ever you want to come and visit me on your own as Salman you are old enough to travel on your own and Osman can come with I will pay for it. or I plan to visit Australia and I promise when I come I will do every thing to see you.
Ps Yusuf Pender is a very nice and good natured young man.

Posted by: Ibrahim Noonan at January 9, 2008 10:40 AM

•••

this is salman, im am the son of michael noonan or ibrahim noonan.

im just responding to what was said in past commentts made about my muother. i have a high level of respect for my father and the fact that he is so loyal to his religion but i dont appreciate people sayin my mum was the ones causing problems when it was all my fathers wife. i would very much like to get in contact with you dad as i would liek to know what type of person you are.

salman.

Posted by: Marina Ayaz at June 7, 2008 03:13 PM

•••

This is my uncle haha, he’s my dad’s brother. I mightn’t follow a religion, but I’m open minded and spiritual, and I respect Michael for what he’s doing, and what he believes. Too many stereotypes have been given to people of Islamic faith, I know a few Muslims and they’re really nice people, haha. Just felt like I should voice that :}

Posted by: Conor Noonan at September 24, 2010 04:34 PM

•••

What a nice family you are. If only you would all swap phone numbers, get together from time to time, bite the bullet and move on. Surely that is better than working it out on public internet forums.

P.S. Islam is the true religion (but not that codswallop Ahmadiyyah nonsense that Mick/Ibrahim is on). The Prophet Muhammad said “The best of you is the one who’s best to his family” and “The strong person is not the one who overpowers his opponent in a fight, but the strong one is the one who controls his anger” and “Whoever humbles himself for the sake of God, God will exalt him”

Assalaam alaykum,
Peace be upon you,
Adam

Posted by: Adam Noonan at January 31, 2013 11:11 AM

•••

I’m Fawad Noonan ,Ibrahim Noonans son , I’d like to point out all that I have jus read is bull and to the guy above ,adam, if you were a true muslim ud follow sunnah and if u knew sunnah ud know that the Prophet Muhammed (SAW) did not degrade or insult any relgion … So ti insuly the Ahmadiyaa the True version of Islam which is a sect in Islam due to ur ignorance or lack knowladge maybe you didn’t know that .. Adam a wise man once said if u habe nothing good to say keep qutie … Salam

Posted by: Fawad at July 23, 2013 03:55 AM

#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #ahmadiyyat #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #drsalam #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Sialkot #Mosqueattack

Who is the British Military Officer Captain Montague William Douglas?

Intro
Captain Montague William Douglas also known as M.W. Douglas, District Magistrate, District Gurdaspur in 1897.   Lt. Col Montagu William Douglas CSI, CIE. (1863 – February 1957) was a British soldier and colonial administrator in India. As the Assistant District Commissioner in the Punjab, he investigated the attempted murder allegation made by Henry Martyn Clark against Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, the founder of the Ahmadiyya movement. Ahmad later declared him to be the “Pilate of our time”, superior to the original. In his later life he was a noted advocate of the Oxfordian theory of Shakespeare authorship and was president of the Shakespeare Fellowship for many years.  In 1939, he met with the Ahmadi mullah JD Shams and even presided on a Jalsa in the UK, hence he proved that he colluded with MGA to exonerate him.  In 1897, he was a captain in the British Military as well as a judge, in fact, all British officers doubled as corrupt Judges.

He was born to Edward Douglas, (1831–1867) and Annie Arbuthnot, (b. 1831). In February 1884 he joined the 1st Battalion, North Staffordshire Regiment, switching to the Indian army in 1887. He was promoted to captain in 1895.

In 1891, Douglas married Helen Mary Isabelle Downer (b. 1863). They had three children, Edward Montagu Douglas (b. 1891), Major Archibald Stair Montagu Douglas, MM, (1897–1974),[1] and Helen Elizabeth Douglas (b. 1893).[2][3]

1897

In 1897, having been appointed assistant district commissioner in the Punjab, Douglas was required to investigate the allegations of Henry Martyn Clark against Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. Clark, a Christian missionary, had been approached by a youth named Abdul Hamid, who claimed that Ahmad had sent him to kill Clark. Douglas found Hamid’s claims to be implausible, and that there was evidence that Hamid had been coached. He had also repeatedly changed and even retracted his story. Douglas dismissed the charges. Even after more than forty years he vividly remembered the case and its details. He wrote to J. D. Shams, an Ahmadiyya missionary in London on 29 July 1939, “… the evidence was false and thus I acquitted Mirza Ghulam Ahmad”.[4] The aftermath was presented by Ahmad’s supporters as a triumph, and as evidence of Ahmad’s divine mission.[5] Subsequently, Ahmad compared Douglas favourably with Pontius Pilate, declaring him to be a man of much superior character, stating,

“”””In my opinion, Captain Douglas outshines Pilate in imparting judgment fearlessly and in showing determination and steadfastness … Pilate showed cowardice due to fear of the High Priest and the Elders, and acted in a cowardly manner. But Captain Douglas showed no sign of weakness … Those who are blessed with honour from above do not hanker after worldly honours. This commendable courtesy by the ‘Pilate’ of our time shall be remembered by all my followers when I am gone. He shall be remembered till the end of the world with love and respect.””””[6][7]

In his book Kitab ul Baryyah (An Account of Exoneration) Mirza Ghulam Ahmad has narrated the details of the case.[8]

 

Later career and retirement

Douglas was appointed Deputy Commissioner in 1899, and was promoted to Major on 6 February 1902.[9] He was on the executive committee for the Coronation Durbar at Delhi in 1903. From 1910-1913 he was Deputy Commissioner of the Lylpur District. He then served as Chief Commissioner of the Andaman and Nicobar Islands from 1913–1920.[10][11]

Douglas was honoured as Companion of the Order of the Indian Empire (CIE) in 1903 and as Companion of the Order of the Star of India (CSI) in 1919.

In his retirement he was an advocate of Oxfordian theory of Shakespeare authorship and wrote The Earl of Oxford as “Shakespeare”; an outline of the case (1931).[12] In 1928 he became president of The Shakespeare Fellowship, after the death of its founder George Greenwood. He held the post until 1945. Douglas advocated a “group theory” of Shakespeare authorship with Oxford as the “master mind”.[13] In Lord Oxford and the Shakespeare Group (1952) he expanded his theory, asserting that Oxford’s fellow-contributors were Francis Bacon, Christopher Marlowe, the Earl of Derby, John Lyly and Robert Greene.[14] According to James S. Shapiro Douglas also believed that “Queen Elizabeth had entrusted Oxford to oversee a propaganda department that would produce patriotic plays and pamphlets”.[15]

In his later life he also painted and was among amateurs exhibited at the Royal Academy.

References

  1.  Biographical history of Gonville and Caius College Ernest Stewart Roberts, Edward John Gross – 1948 p169 “Douglas, Archibald Stair Montagu: son of Lieut. -Colonel Montagu William Douglas, CI.E., of Port Blair, Andaman Islands; and Helen Mary ..”
  2. ^ The Douglas Archives
  3. ^ Portraits in the India Office Library and Records p63 India Office Library and Records, Pauline Rohatgi – 1983 “Douglas, Montagu William (1863–1957) Lieut -Colonel. Deputy Commissioner, Punjab 1910-13 FL seated in Delhi Planning Committee group. Photo 206 x 271mm “
  4. ^ Letter dated 29 July 1939 to J D Shams
  5. ^ Muhammad Zafrulla Khan, Ahmadiyyat: the renaissance of Islam, Tabshir Publications, 1978, p.189.
  6. ^ Tadhkirat-ush-Shahadatain, Ruhani Khaza’in, vol. 20, pp. 30-41.
  7. ^ Tadh-Kiratushaha-Datain online
  8. ^ Kitab ul Baryyah
  9. ^ “No. 27428”The London Gazette. 25 April 1902. p. 2795.
  10. ^ List of Rulers Provinces British India
  11. ^ David P. Henige, Colonial governors from the fifteenth century to the present, 1970, p.84
  12. ^ H. N. Gibson, The Shakespeare Claimants: A Critical Survey of the Four Principal Theories Concerning the Authorship of the Shakespearean Plays, Taylor & Francis, 1962, p.73.
  13. ^ R. C. Churchill, Shakespeare and His Betters: A History and a Criticism of the Attempts Which Have Been Made to Prove That Shakespeare’s Works Were Written by Others, Max Reinhardt, London, 1938, p. 51
  14. ^ Schoenbaum, Sam, Shakespeare’s Lives, Oxford University Press, 1991, p.435.
  15. ^ James Shapiro, Contested Will: Who Wrote Shakespeare?, Faber & Faber, 2011, p.216.

 

Links and Related Essays

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/10/13/who-is-jalal-ud-din-shams/

 

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/12/06/who-is-maulvi-burhanuddin-of-jhelum-1830-1905/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2019/01/05/the-statement-of-dr-clarke-on-solemn-affirmation-on-12th-august-1897-vs-mirza-ghulam-ahmad/

http://www.ahmadiyya.org/bookspdf/bar/bar180-201-frm.htm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/12/26/the-mirza-family-was-above-the-law-in-british-india/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Lekh

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Athim

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/08/even-in-1907-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-was-still-lusting-for-his-niece-muhammadi-begum/

http://www.ahmadiyya.org/bookspdf/bar/bar180-201-frm.htm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-sent-abdul-hameed-to-murder-dr-clark-after-lekh-ram-was-murdered/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-sent-abdul-hameed-to-murder-dr-clark-after-lekh-ram-was-murdered/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/04/05/when-the-athim-prophecy-was-about-to-expire/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/12/17/lekh-rams-murder-the-details-aryasamaj-lekhram/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/03/19/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-had-5-written-debates-no-oral-debates/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/04/03/the-punjab-mission-news-and-mirza-ghulam-ahmads-death-prophecy-vs-athim/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/06/anjam-e-athim-1897-quotes/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/10/16/mgas-nasty-poetry-vs-the-christian-abdullah-athim/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/06/13/after-mirza-ghulam-ahmads-lost-the-debate-with-athim-3-of-his-followers-left-ahmadiyya/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/17/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-vs-athim-through-the-lens-of-asif-m-basit-review-of-religions-2013/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/06/anjam-e-athim-1897-quotes/

Tags
#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

Pictures with JD Shams from 1939

Captain M.W. Douglas, District Magistrate, District Gurdaspur received Abdul Hameed and saved MGA

Intro
Captain M.W. Douglas, District Magistrate, District Gurdaspur was given a serious court case vs. MGA in 1897.  However, since MGA was above the law in British-India, since his father Mirza Ghulam Murtaza helped to kill the mutineers of 1857, MGA was given respite even when he was totally guilty.  Dr. Clarke had initially filed the case in Amritsar, where he lived, however, the courts told him that he was out of jurisdiction, the case was thus transferred to Gurdaspur.  This is the famous case of Abdul Hameed who was a nephew of the famous Ahmadi mullah, Burhan ud Din.  We found this testimony in MGA’s book,. “kitab ul Barriya” (1897), in a Lahori-Ahmadi translation, pages 142-143.

Captain Douglas’ initial comments

9th August 1897

To: Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, son of Mirza Ghulam Murtaza, Caste Mughal, resident of Qadian, sub-division Batala, District Gurdaspur.

Whereas we have been informed by the honourable Magistrate, District Amritsar, and this information is supported by the statements of Dr. Martyn Clarke and Abdul Hameed recorded by the respected officer and sent to us, that you have incited Abdul Hameed to kill Dr. Martyn
Clarke. Consequently there is apprehension that you are about to commit breach of the peace or about to perform an act which is likely to cause breach of the peace. Consequently you are commanded through this Order to present yourself on Tuesday 10th August 1897 during Court hours before the District Magistrate at Batala and explain the reason why you should not be required to deposit a personal surety of one thousand Rupees as penalty, with an undertaking of maintenance of public peace for a period of one year, and why a surety document written by two sureties for Rupees one thousand per surety as penalty be not required to be deposited.
Issued today, dated 9th August 1897, under our signature and seal of the Court.

Signed: District Magistrate, Gurdaspur.
No: 4. Summons to the defendant Under Section 152, Collection of Criminal Procedure Code In the court of Captain Douglas, District Magistrate

To: Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, son of Mirza Ghulam Murtaza, caste Mughal, resident of Qadian Mughlan, sub-division Batala, District Gurdaspur.

Your presence is essential in order to make reply to the accusation under Section 107 Criminal Procedure Code. Hence you are ordered through this document to present yourself in person or through a duly authorised attorney or as the case may be, at Batala, before the District Magistrate on 10th August 1897. Be strictly enjoined of this.

Signed: Magistrate, District Gurdaspur.

Links and Related Essays

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/12/06/who-is-maulvi-burhanuddin-of-jhelum-1830-1905/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2019/01/05/the-statement-of-dr-clarke-on-solemn-affirmation-on-12th-august-1897-vs-mirza-ghulam-ahmad/

http://www.ahmadiyya.org/bookspdf/bar/bar180-201-frm.htm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/12/26/the-mirza-family-was-above-the-law-in-british-india/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Lekh

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Athim

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/08/even-in-1907-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-was-still-lusting-for-his-niece-muhammadi-begum/

http://www.ahmadiyya.org/bookspdf/bar/bar180-201-frm.htm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-sent-abdul-hameed-to-murder-dr-clark-after-lekh-ram-was-murdered/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-sent-abdul-hameed-to-murder-dr-clark-after-lekh-ram-was-murdered/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/04/05/when-the-athim-prophecy-was-about-to-expire/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/12/17/lekh-rams-murder-the-details-aryasamaj-lekhram/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/03/19/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-had-5-written-debates-no-oral-debates/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/04/03/the-punjab-mission-news-and-mirza-ghulam-ahmads-death-prophecy-vs-athim/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/06/anjam-e-athim-1897-quotes/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/10/16/mgas-nasty-poetry-vs-the-christian-abdullah-athim/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/06/13/after-mirza-ghulam-ahmads-lost-the-debate-with-athim-3-of-his-followers-left-ahmadiyya/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/17/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-vs-athim-through-the-lens-of-asif-m-basit-review-of-religions-2013/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/06/anjam-e-athim-1897-quotes/

Tags
#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

Evidence which proves that Mirza Tahir Ahmad radicalized Ahmadi’s as soon as he came to power (1982)

Intro
We have explained before how Mirza Tahir Ahmad came into power in June of 1982 and began to radicalize Ahmadi’s and prepare them to kill themselves and sacrifice their children like sheep.  We have also asserted that Mirza Tahir Ahmad worked with Zia behind the scenes on Ord-XX and purposely got it passed so that he could move his headquarters to the UK.  We have recently found a speech of Mirza Tahir Ahmad from the final Jalsa in Rabwah in December of 1983.  In this video, Mirza Tahir Ahmad is telling Ahmadi’s to be ready to lose their lands, livelyhoods and children for the sake of Ahmadiyya.  However, this is alarming since from November of 1974 to December 1983, there were almost no major issues between the Pakistani government and Ahmadi’s.  This was a peaceful era.  So what was Mirza Tahir Ahmad preparing Ahmadi’s for?  One last point, by 1982, Ahmadi’s were still over-represented in the government of Pakistan.

The video clip from twitter

The short video clip

The full video
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=1983+rabwah+jalsa+with+subtitles

Links and Related Essays

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/11/10/in-1976-during-his-usa-tour-and-at-the-usa-jalsa-mirza-nasir-ahmad-claims-10-million-ahmadis/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/08/12/jalsa-germany-2018-is-fast-approaching/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/11/28/mirza-tahir-ahmad-radicalized-ahmadis-in-the-80s/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/11/20/mirza-tahir-ahmad-was-a-vicious-mullah/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/12/25/statistics-showing-systematic-over-representation-of-ahmadis-in-the-bureaucracy-of-pakistan-by-charles-h-kennedy/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/16/the-ahmadiyya-jalsausa-is-a-marketing-event-nothing-else/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/30/ahmadis-always-lie-about-conversions-at-the-ukjalsa/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/06/05/mirza-tahir-ahmad-explains-how-and-why-ahmadis-have-always-lied-about-their-global-membership-number/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/08/07/mirza-basheer-uddin-mahmud-ahmad-admits-that-ahmadis-lie-about-their-membership-numbers/

Tags
#1983 #rabwahjalsa #jalsa #Jalsarabwah #Jalsapakistan #ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

Who is Abdul Hameed?

Intro
He was raised by the famous Ahmadi mullah, Maulvi Burhan ud Din from Jehlum(died in 1905).  Burhan ud Din was a member of the “Ahl-e-Hadith”, just like MGA.  Burhan ud Din and other Ahmadi’s radicalized Abdul Hameed and prepared him mentally to commit a murder (Dr. Clarke).  He was brought up as a child by one Sultan Mahmood, an Ahmadi preacher at Jhelum. His mother was married to this Sultan Mahmood and she had been previously the wife of one Luqman, a brother of Sultan Mahmood, on whose decease she contracted the second marriage. Abdul Hameed is said to be the son of Luqman (See Dard, Chapter 57) .  Abdul Hameed showed up at the Church residence of Dr. Clark on the presumption that he wished to convert to Christianity from Islam.  A few weeks later he confessed to Dr. Clark that he had been sent by MGA to murder the said doctor.  The reason might be that Dr. Clark was heavily involved with MGA’s debate vs. Athim.  MGA and his team had extended a death prophecy to Dr. Clark also.  Furthermore, this event happened just a few weeks after Lekh Ram had been brutally murdered after MGA’s death prophecy failed to work on March 6th, 1897.

A venereal disease?
Noorudin and Dr. Clarke report that this Ahmadi had a venereal disease while he was in Qadian.  Abdul Hameed also said that he regularly massaged MGA.

Dr. Henry Martyn Clark (also spelled as Clarke)
He was a Christian missionary working in Amritsar.  He brought a charge, under section 107 I.P.C., against MGA on August 1st, 1897, in the court of Mr. A.E. Martineau, District Magistrate of Amritsar. Dr. Clark stated that MGA had sent a youth, Abdul Hamid, to murder him (See Tadhkirah, the 2009 online edition, page 392).  On the same day a warrant was issued for MGA’s arrest.

August 6th, 1897
The District Magistrate of Amritsar sent a letter wherein he cancelled the arrest warrant.  The case was then transferred to Gurdaspur.

Capt. M. W. Douglas was the District Magistrate of Gurdaspur
He eventually became a colonel.  The enquiry against MGA began on August 10, 1897. In the
preliminary report, Capt. Douglas said on the basis of evidence brought before him that he could not possibly charge MGA with any offense.  Dr. Clark said in the course of his statement before the District Magistrate of Gurdaspur that he had no intention of instituting any criminal proceedings against MGA  until July 31, 1897.

Capt. Douglas delivered judgement on August 23, 1897
He read about MGA’s father and thus gave MGA a chair to sit on while he was in court, wherein Batalvi and other Indian’s were never given anything to sit on.  Batalvi was just a witness in the court case, however, he was talked down upon by Douglas, Douglas even went so far as to insult him.

Abdul Hameed was sentenced
Abdul Hameed seems to have escaped at this point.  However, he was caught later on and he was convicted on September 11th, 1899, and sentenced to nine months rigorous imprisonment whereof 44 days had to be passed in solitary confinement. To Mr. J. R. Drummond it was all a mystery. He was constrained to remark in his judgment:

“”””It is by no means clear what the springs have been that produced this chapter in the obscure history that has cenetred seriously for the past few years round the new religious movement of which Abdul Hamid pretended (falsely as one of my predecessors has held) to be a selected emissary.”””” (See Dard).

Links and Related Essays

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2019/01/05/abdul-hameeds-extended-comments-on-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-sending-him-to-murder-dr-clarke/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2019/01/05/the-statement-of-dr-clarke-on-solemn-affirmation-on-12th-august-1897-vs-mirza-ghulam-ahmad/

http://www.ahmadiyya.org/bookspdf/bar/bar180-201-frm.htm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/12/26/the-mirza-family-was-above-the-law-in-british-india/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Lekh

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Athim

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/08/even-in-1907-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-was-still-lusting-for-his-niece-muhammadi-begum/

http://www.ahmadiyya.org/bookspdf/bar/bar180-201-frm.htm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-sent-abdul-hameed-to-murder-dr-clark-after-lekh-ram-was-murdered/

Tags
#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

 

 

Ruhani Khazain, the breakdown

Intro
Ruhani Khuzain is an attempt at editing the writings of MGA and his team.  Its heavily edited, the original books have been checked by our team and we have seen many issues.  In the below, we have given the breakdown of what books fall into whichever category of RK.

The list

Home > The Promised Messiah > Ruhani Khazain
Ruhani Khazain
Books of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian, The Promised Messiah and Imam Mahdi

Ruhani Khazain – Books of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian, The Promised Messiah and Mahdi (peace be on him)

Originally written in Arabic, Persian and Urdu. New Computerized Edition Published in 23 Volumes.

Message by Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad, Khalifatul Masih V(at) on the occasion of publication of Ruhani Khazain: English | Urdu

Ruhani Khazain

Read Online with Search — Available in English and Urdu

Ruhani Khazain Online (Computerized)
Google-based Search in Urdu

Available English Translations
English Search in Translations

Topic based Subject Index – Urdu

Subject Index
Ruhani Khazain, Malfuzat and Majmua Ishtiharat
Urdu Index of Ruhani Khazain | (PDF) (PDF) | مفتاح الخزائن

Download PDF files:

Ruhani Khazain Volume 1 1 
Braheen-i-Ahmadiyya (Vol. 1 to 4)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 2 2 
Purani Tahreerain, Surma Chashm Ariya, Shuhna Haq, Sabz Ishthar  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 3 3 
Fateh Islam, Tauzeeh Maram, Izala Auham  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 4 4 
Al-Haq Ludhiana, Al-Haq Dehli, Asmani Faisla, Nishan-e-Asmani, Aik Esai Ke Teen Sawal Aur Un Ke Jawabat  _  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 5 5 
A’ina Kamalat Islam

Ruhani Khazain Volume 6 6 
Barakat-uddua’, Hujja-tul-Islam, Suchhai-ka-Izhar, Jang-e-Moqaddas, Shahadat-ul-Quran  _  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 7 7 
Tuhfa Bughdad, Karamat-us-Sadiqeen, Hamama-tul-Bushra
Hamama-tul-Bushra (Urdu translation)
Tuhfa Bughdad, Karamat-us-Sadiqeen, Targheeb-ul-Momineen (Urdu translation)
 _  _ 
حَمامۃُ البشریٰ (اُردو ترجمہ)
تحفہ بغداد، کرامات الصادقین، ترغیب المؤمنین فی اعلاء کملۃ الدین (اُردو ترجمہ)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 8 8 
Nur-ul-Haq (1 & 2), Ittemam-ul-Hujjat, Sirrul Khalafa
Ittemam-ul-Hujjat (Urdu translation)
Sirrul Khalafa (Urdu translation)
 _  _ 
اِتمام الحُجَّۃ (اُردو ترجمہ)
سرّ الخلافۃ (اُردو ترجمہ)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 9 9 
Anwarul-Islam, Minan-ur-Rehman, Zia-ul-Haq, Noor-ul-Quran (1 & 2), Ma’yar-al-Mazahib  _  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 10 10 
Ariya Dharam, Satt-Bachan, Islami-Asool-ki-Philosphy  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 11 11 
Anjaam Aatham

Ruhani Khazain Volume 12 12 
Siraj-e-Munir, Istafta, Hujjatullah, Tauhfa Qaisiria, Mahmood-ki-Amin, Sirajuddin Esai-ke-Char Sawalon-ka-Jawab  _  _  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 13 13 
Kitab-ul-Bariyyah, Al-Balagh, Zarurat-ul-Imam  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 14 14 
Najm-ul-Huda’, Raz-i-Haqiqat, Kashful-Ghita’, Ayyam-us-Sulh, Haqiqatul-Mehdi  _  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 15 15 
Maseeh Hindustan Mein, Sitara Qaisra, Teryaqul-Qoloob, Tauhfa-Ghaznivia, Ruadad-Jalsa-Dua’  _  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 16 16 
Khutba-Ilhamia, Lujja-tun-Noor
Khutba-Ilhamia (Urdu translation)
Lujja-tun-Noor (Urdu translation)
 _ 
خطبۃ الہامیۃ (اُردو ترجمہ)
لُجَّۃُ النُّور (اُردو ترجمہ)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 17 17 
Government Angrezi Aur Jihad, Toufah-Golravea’, Arbaeen  _  _ 

Ruhani Khazain Volume 18 18 
Ijazul-Masih, Aik Ghalati Ka Azala, Dafi-ul-Bala, Al-Huda, Nuzul-ul-Masih, Gunah Say Nijat Kionkar Mil Sakti Hay? Ismat-e-Anbiya

Ijazul-Masih (Urdu translation)
Al-Huda (Urdu translation)

 _  _  _  _  _  _ 
اعجاز المسیح (اُردو ترجمہ)
الہدیٰ (اُردو ترجمہ)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 19 19 
Kashti Nooh, Tuhfat-un-Nadwa, Ijaz-e-Ahmadi, Review Mubahasa Batalvi-Chakralwi, Muwahib-ur-Rehman, Naseem-e-Dawat, Sanatan Dharam
Muwahib-ur-Rehman (Urdu translation)
 _  _  _  _  _  _ 
مواھب الرحمن (اُردو ترجمہ)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 20 20 
Tadhkirat-ush-Shahadatain, Seerat-ul-Abdal, Lecture Lahore, Islam (Lecture Sialkot), Lecture Ludhiana, Al-Wasiyat, Chashma Masihi, Tajalliyyat-i-Ilahiyyah, Qadian-ke-Ariya Aur Hum, Ahmadi or Ghair Ahmadi Main Kia Faraq Hay?
Tadhkirat-ush-Shahadatain (Urdu translation)
Seerat-ul-Abdal (Urdu translation)
 _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _ 
تذکرۃ الشھادتین مع علامات المقربین (اُردو ترجمہ)
سیرۃ الابدال (اُردو ترجمہ)

Ruhani Khazain Volume 21 21 
Braheen Ahmadiyya – Vol. 5

Ruhani Khazain Volume 22 22 
Haqiqat-ul-Wahi
Al-Istifta (Urdu translation)

الاستفتاٴ اردو ترجمہ

Ruhani Khazain Volume 23 23 
Chashma Ma’rafat, Paigham-i-Sulh  _ 

 

Links and Related Essays

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/11/16/ahmadis-keep-editing-mgas-writings/

https://www.alislam.org/urdu/rk/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/05/04/ahmadiyya-mullahs-have-been-caught-editing-the-writings-of-mga-yet-again/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/10/04/maulvi-sher-ali-told-the-world-that-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-would-send-his-arabic-writings-to-noorudin-and-ahsan-amrohi-for-editing/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/26/ahmadiyya-leadership-is-always-editing-books-on-ahmadiyya-and-mgas-so-called-ilhams/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/11/17/ahmadis-editing-their-books-on-piggot/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/06/mga-used-scribes/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/10/ahmadiyya-leadership-admitted-that-mga-used-lots-of-editors-and-ghost-writers/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=ghost+writers

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/02/06/hani-tahir-exposes-ahmadiyya-lies-again-the-arabic-of-mga/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/06/was-noorudin-the-ghost-writer-of-mga/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/30/mgas-ghost-writers-argue-on-the-prophethood-of-mga-in-1900/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/09/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-and-muqamat-al-hariri/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/01/02/mufti-muhammad-sadiq-was-a-student-of-noorudin-pre-1891/

Tags
#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

In the early 1890’s, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad claimed that the British Government’s control of India would end in 8 years

Intro
MGA made many strange predictions about the future.  Another weird one is his prediction about the British Government.  He had a revelation in Persian which indicated that the British government would end its rule in India in 8 years.  Later on, this revelation was deleted by the Ahmadiyya editing team.  In Seeratul Mahdi,  Volume 1 page 68,  Mirza Bashir Ahmad mentioned three names Haji Abdul Majeed, Haifz Hamid Ali and Mian Abdullah Sanwari as witnessed that MGA received a revelation in which it was mentioned that rule British Government will end in 8 years. One out of these three witness (Mian Abdullah Sanauri) says that he remembers this revelation like it was etched in stone.  As time passed British Rule became stronger and stronger day by day. Mirza realized that he has fired a wrong bullet so in Roohani Khazain Volume 14 page 216 (Kashful Ghita) he denied this ILHAM altogether (see the scan in the below), it can also be found on pages 38-39 of the 1898 english edition of Kashf-ul-Ghita).  MGA denied this prophecy mainly because one of his friends informed of this prophesy to Molana Muhammad Hussain Batalvi and he published it in his magazine Ishaat us sunnah. Mirza got scared that his masters, the Britishers would not like this so he denied it.  We don’t have the original scan from that newspaper as of yet.  Nevertheless, Ahmadi’s archived this revelation of MGA after the Khalifa authenticated it in 1929.

2009 online english edition of Tadhkirah, see page, 1017
[Persian] [The British Empire will last for eight years; thereafter there will be weakness, disturbance and decline.]

[al-Fadl, vol. 16, no. 78, April 5, 1929, p. 5]

Jalal ud Din Shams’ commentary on this persian revelation
Shams was an employee of the Mirza family and a major editor, you will see his notes all over the literature of the Ahmadiyya Movement.  He claims that this revelation was fulfilled via the death of Queen Victoria in 1901.  Shams doesn’t mention that this book was published in English in 1898.

Additional references from the 2009 online english edition of Tadhkirah, see page 1018

Hafiz Hamid ‘Ali narrated to me (((Refers to Haji ‘Abdul-Majid))), …that Hadrat Sahib [the Promised Messiah] received the revelation:

[Persian] [The British Empire will last for eight years, thereafter there will be the days of
weakness, and decline.]

[Siratul-Mahdi, part 1, p. 75, no. 96, 2nd ed]

Sahibzadah Pir Sirajul-Haqq Nu‘mani narrates that he has heard this revelation as following:

[Persian] [The power of the British will last for eight years, thereafter there will be the days of weakness, and decline.]

[Siratul-Mahdi, vol. 2, p. 9, Riwayat no. 314]

The scans

Links and Related Essays

http://www.aaiil.org/text/books/mga/kashfulghita/kashfulghitaenglish.pdf

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/08/25/who-is-mirza-bashir-ahmad-the-younger-brother-of-mirza-basheer-uddin-mahmud-ahmad/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/10/04/maulvi-sher-ali-told-the-world-that-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-would-send-his-arabic-writings-to-noorudin-and-ahsan-amrohi-for-editing/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Noorudinhttps://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Amrohi

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=arabic

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/02/06/hani-tahir-exposes-ahmadiyya-lies-again-the-arabic-of-mga/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=ghost+writershttps://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=right+arm

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/06/lecture-ludhiana-was-not-a-lecture-it-was-a-riot/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/10/12/the-story-of-how-mga-hurt-his-right-arm-and-was-disabled-since-his-youth/

http://www.thecult.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=590&p=4929&hilit=Ghita#p4929

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/16/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-needed-toilet-attendants-his-entire-life/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/12/15/who-is-mirza-ghulam-murtaza-1791-1876/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/01/13/mirza-sultan-ahmad-mgas-eldest-son/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/06/mga-used-scribes/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/07/10/ahmadiyya-leadership-admitted-that-mga-used-lots-of-editors-and-ghost-writers/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=ghost+writers

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/05/04/ahmadiyya-mullahs-have-been-caught-editing-the-writings-of-mga-yet-again/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/10/04/maulvi-sher-ali-told-the-world-that-mirza-ghulam-ahmad-would-send-his-arabic-writings-to-noorudin-and-ahsan-amrohi-for-editing/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Noorudin

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=Amrohi

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=arabic

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/02/06/hani-tahir-exposes-ahmadiyya-lies-again-the-arabic-of-mga/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/06/was-noorudin-the-ghost-writer-of-mga/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/30/mgas-ghost-writers-argue-on-the-prophethood-of-mga-in-1900/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/09/18/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-and-muqamat-al-hariri/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/01/02/mufti-muhammad-sadiq-was-a-student-of-noorudin-pre-1891/

Tags
#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad vs. Molana Muhammad Hussain Batalvi and Muslims leaders in British-India in August of 1891

Intro
MGA avoided public debates, in fact, he only competed in 5 total debates in his 30- year career (1878–1908), and they were all written debates.  MGA stuttered and was thus incapable of articulating in any language.  In July 1891, MGA had a scheduled debate with Molana Muhammad Hussain Batalvi at Ludhiana and ran away from there on 31 July.

Summary of the scans in the below
( from Ishaat us sunnah Volume-14 , publication Year 1891, pages 2 onwards)

After being humiliated at Ludhiana, Mirza in his Ishtihar dated 1st August 1891, invited Batalvi to have a debate with him at Lahore. Batalvi replied that he is ready to debate with him at Lahore Peshawar or Qadian. However, MGA backed out yet again.

He then planned to try his luck at Dehli. He reached Dehli in October, 1891, where he published an Ishtihar challenging Molvi Syed Nazir Hussain for a debate he also put the name of Molvi Abdul Haq in his Ishtihar. MGA thought Molvi Nazir and Abdul Haq, due to their old age, would not come to face him and Molana Batalvi would also be far away from Dehli so he would get a “walk over.”

What happened was that Molvi Abdul Haq accepted the challenge and Molana Muhammad Hussain Batalvi (ever chasing MGA), also reached Delhi. Before the arrival of Molana Muhammad Hussain Batalvi, MGA had negotiated the debate on the following un reasonable terms and conditions:-

a.)Special permission of Deputy Commissioner should be issued in his name.
b.)A European officer should be ever present in the gathering.
c.) Debators should write with their hands and read over to public no munshi or Scribe is permitted.

But when Muhammad Hussain Batalvi reached Dehli, MGA went to Molana Abdul Haq and said your name was mentioned in the debate erroneously . He said I do not want to debate with you. Molvi Abdul Haq said he is ready to withdraw if you publish an ishtihar to this effect. So MGA issued an Ishtihar on 6th of October saying that he do not want to debate with Molvi Abdul haq because he had met him and found him a monk like person. He do not like to interact with govt officials hence he would debate only with Nazir Hussain who may keep Muhammad Hussain Batalvi with him for assistance during debate.

This trick, however failed when Molvi Abdul Haq replied in a published Ishtihar that he can arrange anything and invited Mirza sb to come to the Town Hall on 11th October for this debate otherwise he would be termed as liar. Mean time Muhammad Hussain Batalvi published Ishtihar inviting MGA to have debate with him if he loses then MGA may debate with Molvi Nazir Hussain. He requested him to come to the Chandni Mahal on 11th Oct, 1891 at 9.AM. The ishtihar further states that all terms and conditions laid by you are acceptable and we do not lay any terms and condition from our side. All arrangements have been finalized with the expenditures of hand sum amount.

MGA replied that he hates to debate with Molvi Muhammad Hussain and would have it with Molvi Nazir Hussain only. This refusal was accepted by Molvi Nazir Hussain and MGA was informed that his challenge to Debate with Molvi Nazir Hussain, has been accepted and he must come to Chandni Mahal on 11th Oct. However MGA breached this agreement on the pretext of law and order situation and wrote a letter to defer this debate till Ghulam Qadir would inform Deputy Commissioner.

On 5th October, Molvi Nazir Hussain wrote to MGA to come to his house and talk to him directly to remove his apprehensions, still MGA refused and said there should be a European officer in the debate. After that 14 letters were sent to MGA for debate from Ulema of Dehli inviting MGA, but he refused them all.

One of them was Molvi Abdul Majeed who invited MGA and offered a reward money of Rs 1000/-in case MGA prove his claims.  Molvi Rahim Bakhsh invited MGA, Molvi Mujaddid Ali Khan too invited MGA for debate on 10th Oct at Masjid Fatehpuri , Molvi Abdul Hamid invited MGA to come to the roof top of his house and he would be at his roof top, there would be Bazar between two and no risk of life would be there, but MGA did not agree and dared not to come out of his heavily guarded house.

MGA failure to debate at Chandni Mahal brought great humiliations to him. So he thought of washing of this defamation. He brought another Ishtihar dated 17 Oct 1891 wherein he used abusive language against Molvi Nazir Hussain and challenged to declare him liar in his claims and in his arguments under oath in open before general public. Molvi Nazir Hussain went to Jamia Masjid Dehli with general public and sent message to Mirza sb that he is ready to give such statement under oath now come to us in Jamia Masjid and state your claims and arguments before us.

This message was given to MGA through Nawab Saeeduddin Khan of Loharo, Molvi Abdul Majid and Mir Basharat Hussain Kotwal City.  Nevertheless, MGA refused again.

After prayer Molvi Abdul Majid, Nawab Saeeduddin Khan and Syed Bashir Hussain Inspector Police went to MGA and asked him to give them in writing that he would repent if Molvi Nazir Hussain rejects his claims and arguments on oath. MGA got puzzled on this demand and remained silent. However, his deputy Mullahs stood up and said we would repent after one month subject to the condition that Molvi Nazir Hussain would not fall ill or suffer from fever and headache during this period.

Subsequently, few questions were asked from Mirza sb through the City Superintendent Sahab Bahdur, as under:

City Superintendent: why Do you not cut short your arguments and agree to give a written statement.

MGA and his team:- we want to talk on the life and death issue of Jesus Pbuh and nothing else.
Molvi Abdul Majid :-We want to settle this issue including all of your claims. Do you have a proof to your claim of Messiah ship.

MGA and his team : same answer.

City Superintendent:– Addressing to Mirza sb, Are you Messiah? If yes what is the proof? Suppose Jesus has died then why should you be considered a Messiah give us a proof?

MGA :-Remains silent.

Khwaja Muhammad Yusuf from MGA side: addressing to Molvi Sahib , Hazrat if someone wants to be muslim why do do you not allow him to be?

Molvi sb: Yes if he repents he is our brother!
Khwaja sb: I can bring his written repentance just now. He would write it down that whatever he wrote against Quraan and Hadis is rejected and he is a muslim.

MGA wrote repentance but in the same language as that of he published in his Ishtihar of 12 October.

Molvi sb. He should write that he seeks repentance from Allah for whatever anti Islam he wrote in Tozihula maram, Fathe Islam and Izala auham.

After few more meaningless exchanges between the parties, the City Superintendent Sahab Bahadur announces to end the proceeding and MGA and his deputy mullahs returned under police escort.

Scans

 

Links and Related Essays

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2016/09/06/mirza-ghulams-ahmad-lecture-in-amritsar-nov-1905-was-not-a-lecture-it-was-a-riot/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/10/15/mirza-ghulam-ahmads-debate-with-batalvi-summer-of-1891-was-stopped-by-the-british-govt-on-mgas-behalf/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/06/27/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-spoke-with-a-terrible-stutter-and-ahmadiyya-leadership-lied-about-it-they-called-it-a-stammer/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/03/19/mga-lost-the-debate-with-molvi-muhammad-bashir-bhopali-1891/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/03/19/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-had-5-written-debates-no-oral-debates/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2018/04/23/in-1891-when-mga-made-his-big-claims-he-denied-prophethood-mufti-sadiq-was-heavily-involved/

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/?s=ghost

https://ahmadiyyafactcheckblog.com/2017/11/05/mirza-ghulam-ahmad-embarrassed-noorudin-in-1891/

Tags
#ahmadiyya #ahmadiyyatrueislam #ahmadiapartheid #Ahmadiyyat #rabwah #qadian #meetthekhalifa #muslimsforpeace #ahmadiyyafactcheckblog #nolifewithoutkhalifa #AhmadiMosqueattack #AhmadiyyaPersecution #Mosqueattack #trueislam #atifmian

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