Ahmadi’s have been brainwashed to purposely mi-interpret the Quran, hadith and the classic Tafsir’s. Hence, they have went through lots of hadith, classical commentary and cherry-picked and refuse to give a context, and refuse to properly reference as refuse to be academically honest. We have caught them lying and mis-representing the writings of Ibn Kathir, Suyuti and a specific hadith given by Aisha (ra)and many other topics. This was also quoted by the 2nd Khalifa in the Aug-Sep-1920 edition of the ROR.
Explained in some detail
Qadianis quote another saying:
“Had Moses or Jesus been alive, they would have had to follow me” (Al-Yawaqit wal-Jawahir, p. 240; Fath al-Bayan, vol. 2, p. 246; Tafisir Ibn Kathir, under verse 81 of AI Imran).’
The wording in Tafsir Ibn Kathir is:
لَوْ كَانَ مُوسَى وَعِيسَى حَيَّينِ لَمَا وَسِعَهُما إلا اتِّباعِي
‘If Moses and Jesus had been alive, they would have no choice but to follow me.’
There are certain issues with the narration and its meaning which can be easily understood if one is not preoccupied to believe in something;
1) This narration with a mention of Jesus (PBUH) along with Moses (PBUH) has absolutely no chain recorded anywhere, thus its totally baseless. Truly only the followers of a baseless religion refer to baseless narrations. The proof of burden is upon the Qadianis to show us the complete chain of any such narration that makes a mention of Jesus (PBUH).
2) Even if we, just for the sake of argument, give some consideration to this narration, we have to take it along other narrations on the same lines. Infact there are reliable narrations but they mention Moses (PBUH) only and not Jesus (PBUH). The Holy Prophet (PBUH) said:
لَوْ كَانَ مُوسَى حَيًّا بَيْنَ أَظْهُرِكُمْ مَا حَلَّ لَهُ إِلَّا أَنْ يَتَّبِعَنِي
“If Moses were alive amongst you, he would have had no option but to follow me.”
(Musnad Ahmad 14104. Musnad Abu Ya’la Hadith 2081. Tafsir Ibn Kathir 2/68. Shaykh Hamztul Zain classified it as Hasan in his classification of Musnad Ahmad 11/500 pub. Dar al-Hadith Cairo, 1995)
Now even if we consider Jesus (PBUH) along with Moses (PBUH) in the above narration it still doesn’t go with the Qadiani belief. The Hadith clearly uses the words بَيْنَ أَظْهُرِكُمْ i.e. ‘Amongst you’. This implies that if Moses (PBUH) and Jesus (PBUH) come alive amongst us, they would have no choice but to follow our Last Holy Prophet (PBUH). This way it has nothing to say if either of them is alive anywhere or not. It can only be taken to mean that they are not alive ‘amongst us’ which needs no further proof. Moreover, it is an established belief among Muslims that once Jesus (PBUH) will descend from the Heavens and live ‘amongst us’ he will only follow the Law brought by the Holy Prophet (PBUH).
3) This statement does not say Moses and Jesus, peace be upon them both, are indeed in the same condition. It only stresses that if either of them were in a certain similar situation i.e. if they come amongst us, the Ummah of the Last Prophet (PBUH), they will but have to follow the Holy Prophet in the Law.
All this shows the superficiality and absurdness of Qadiani evidences!
لَوْ كَانَ مُوسَى وَعِيسَى حَيَّينِ لَمَا وَسِعَهُما إلا اتِّباعِي
“”””Holy Prophet saw, peace and blessings of Allah be upon him has said:- If Moses
and Jesus were alive, they would have no alternative but to follow me.”””
(Ibn Kathir: Tafseer ul Quran vol 1 page 378)
_____________________________________________________________________________________________Other online sources for this quote
1- This quote can be found in “Beacon of Truth”, see pages 85-86
2- Life of Ahmad, (1948,but see the 2008, online edition, page 308.
3- “Second Coming of Jesus” by Maulvi Muhammad Ali (1917, but this is from the online english edition of 2002, see page 93.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________These Ahmadi’s purposely ignore the superfluous statements from Ibn Kathir on how Esa (As) hasn’t died yet
_____________________________________________________________________________________________ Ibn Kathir was commenting on 3:81
This is a hadith that Ibn Kathir has given in terms of 3:81. Ibn Kathir translated 3:81 as follows:
(81. And (remember) when Allah took the covenant of the Prophets, saying: “Take whatever I gave you from the Book and Hikmah, and afterwards there will come to you a Messenger confirming what is with you; you must, then, believe in him and help him.” Allah said: “Do you agree (to it) and will you take up Isri” They said: “We agree.” He said: “Then bear witness; and I am with you among the witnesses.”)
Commentary on 3:81 by Ibn Kathir
Allah states that He took a pledge from every Prophet whom He sent from Adam until `Isa, that when Allah gives them the Book and the Hikmah, thus acquiring whatever high grades they deserve, then a Messenger came afterwards, they would believe in and support him. Even though Allah has given the Prophets the knowledge and the prophethood, this fact should not make them refrain from following and supporting the Prophet who comes after them. This is why Allah, the Most High, Most Honored, said
﴿وَإِذْ أَخَذَ اللَّهُ مِيثَـقَ النَّبِيِّيْنَ لَمَآ ءَاتَيْتُكُم مِّن كِتَـبٍ وَحِكْمَةٍ﴾
(And (remember) when Allah took the covenant of the Prophets, saying: “Take whatever I gave you from the Book and Hikmah.”) meaning, if I give you the Book and the Hikmah,
﴿ثُمَّ جَآءَكُمْ رَسُولٌ مُّصَدِّقٌ لِّمَا مَعَكُمْ لَتُؤْمِنُنَّ بِهِ وَلَتَنصُرُنَّهُ قَالَ ءَأَقْرَرْتُمْ وَأَخَذْتُمْ عَلَى ذلِكُمْ إِصْرِى﴾
(“and afterwards there will come to you a Messenger confirming what is with you; you must, then, believe in him and help him.” Allah said, “Do you agree (to it) and will you take up Isri”)
Ibn `Abbas, Mujahid, Ar-Rabi`, Qatadah and As-Suddi said that `Isri’ means, “My covenant.” Muhammad bin Ishaq said that,
(Isri) means, “The responsibility of My covenant that you took,” meaning, the ratified pledge that you gave Me.
﴿قَالُواْ أَقْرَرْنَا قَالَ فَاشْهَدُواْ وَأَنَاْ مَعَكُمْ مِّنَ الشَّـهِدِينَفَمَنْ تَوَلَّى بَعْدَ ذَلِكَ﴾
(They said: “We agree.” He said: “Then bear witness; and I am with you among the witnesses.” then whoever turns away after this,”) from fulfilling this pledge and covenant, c
﴿فَأُوْلَـئِكَ هُمُ الْفَـسِقُونَ﴾
(they are the rebellious.) `Ali bin Abi Talib and his cousin `Abdullah bin `Abbas said, “Allah never sent a Prophet but after taking his pledge that if Muhammad were sent in his lifetime, he would believe in and support him.” Allah commanded each Prophet to take a pledge from his nation that if Muhammad were sent in their time, they would believe in and support him. Tawus, Al-Hasan Al-Basri and Qatadah said, “Allah took the pledge from the Prophets that they would believe in each other”, and this statement does not contradict what `Ali and Ibn `Abbas stated.
Therefore, Muhammad is the Final Prophet until the Day of Resurrection. He is the greatest Imam, who if he existed in any time period, deserves to be obeyed, rather than all other Prophets. This is why Muhammad led the Prophets in prayer during the night of Isra’ when they gathered in Bayt Al-Maqdis (Jerusalem). He is the intercessor on the Day of Gathering, when the Lord comes to judge between His servants. This is Al-Maqam Al-Mahmud (the praised station) ﴿refer to 17:79﴾ that only Muhammad deserves, a responsibility which the mighty Prophets and Messengers will decline to assume. However, Muhammad will carry the task of intercession, may Allah’s peace and blessings be on him.
﴿أَفَغَيْرَ دِينِ اللَّهِ يَبْغُونَ وَلَهُ أَسْلَمَ مَن فِى السَّمَـوَتِ وَالاٌّرْضِ طَوْعًا وَكَرْهًا وَإِلَيْهِ يُرْجَعُونَ – قُلْ ءَامَنَّا بِاللَّهِ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ عَلَيْنَا وَمَآ أُنزِلَ عَلَى إِبْرَهِيمَ وَإِسْمَـعِيلَ وَإِسْحَـقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ وَالاٌّسْبَاطِ وَمَا أُوتِىَ مُوسَى وَعِيسَى وَالنَّبِيُّونَ مِن رَّبِّهِمْ لاَ نُفَرِّقُ بَيْنَ أَحَدٍ مِّنْهُمْ وَنَحْنُ لَهُ مُسْلِمُونَ – وَمَن يَبْتَغِ غَيْرَ الإِسْلَـمِ دِينًا فَلَن يُقْبَلَ مِنْهُ وَهُوَ فِى الاٌّخِرَةِ مِنَ الْخَـسِرِينَ ﴾
The online version of Tafsir ibn Kathir doesn’t have the quote
It should be noted that Ahmadi’s refuse to give the full page quote by Ibn Kathir, they refuse to give a context to this statement of his, which is a hadith.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________See also, 33:7 and Ibn Kathir’s comments
_____________________________________________________________________________________________Why do Ahmadi’s lie as such?
A large percentage of Ahmadees (at least those in India and Pakistan) are descended from someone who converted to the Ahmadiyya Movement during Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s life. These early converts are very much respected in the Ahmadiyya Movement and are generally considered pious and saintly. Their descendants are usually very proud of them and the Ahmadiyya Movement makes sure (by various means) that the families of these early converts take pride in them. It would be very difficult for an Ahmadee to believe that such a pious
and respected ancestor was wrong in his judgment of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. Therefore, even if an Ahmadee is presented with proofs of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s falsehood, he/she does not open his/her mind to this possibility because that would mean believing that his/her early convert ancestor was befooled.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________Feel free to search a PDF here
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