January 2020

Did Mirza Ghulam Ahmad give money for Islam? Ever??

The problem with Ahmadi’s is that they are stuck in a cycle of loyalty, hence, they are overly argumentative, never listen to feedback and inherently dishonest. I have been trying to discuss Zakat, MGA and Sadaqa, Zakat in British India, Zakat while living under a Kafir government, if MGA ever even gave money to Islamic organizations in British India and other related matters. However, this Ahmadi will not co-operate, just like all Ahmadi’s. He wrote a response to me, however, it is lacking basic knowledge and full of errors and omissions. I don’t defend any religion or any creed. I am a Muslim, however, I don’t listen to any people from 3rd world countries, nor do I follow any Imam’s in the USA, since their knowledge is less than mine. In reality, most Ahmadi’s don’t have the time to have a proper discussion, instead, they are taught to make their arguments and run off and never listen to feedback.

His first argument
He writes: 
“”””What Mr. AFC fails to realize is that Islamic jurisprudence has laid out a set of criteria for the wealth that Zakat is assessed upon. According to Islamic jurists, Zakat is payable at 2.5% of the wealth one possesses above the nisab (minimum amount of wealth one must have before they are liable to pay Zakat) and reaches the nisab threshold, meaning the assessable wealth is in possession of the Muslim for one full lunar year.””””

—Answer: I never questioned this concept or idea. WTH this guy even talking about?
His second argument: 

He then posts a hadith and continued to make the same silly argument, which I had never objected to in the first place, he then writes:

“”””””””””””So in reality our brother Mr. AFC is rejecting the teachings of our beloved master the Holy Prophet (saw) by accusing of The Promised Messiah (as) not paying Zakat.””””

—Answer: But I haven’t rejected this idea of concept, in fact, I agree with it. I only add that Zakat is only payable while a Muslim is living under an islamic government, it wouldn’t have applied in British India, the UK, Canada, the USA and etc.
His 3rd argument

He writes:

“”””The Promised Messiah (as) did not meet the nisab that is required for a Muslim to meet for Zakat to be assessed upon. The Promised Messiah (as) was a servant of God and devoted his entire life for the cause of Islam, defending it from attacks from other religions and fierce opponents of Islam. He did not desire a life of wealth and glamour, and always gave whatever he had to the cause of Islam and its propagation. That is why he was never in possession of wealth that met the nisab threshold because he would always spend in the way of Islam and large amounts of wealth were never in his possession for more than a year.”””””

—Answer: However, in 1898, MGA told the world how much money he was making, which was above the nisab. Why don’t you look it up? He did not devote his entire life to Islam…he worked for the British government as a clerk for 4 years as a punishment from his father, he only left that job when his mother died, since she was also punished. Further, in MGA’s childhood, and after his work in Sialkot, he fought his father’s tenants in court, he was a sort of slum lord, he took a loan on interest (I can give all the refs, you only have to ask). from 1864 to 1876, he traveled all throughout British India to courts as he fought cases for land. Hence, the majority of MGA’s life was spent in worldly pursuits, he even took the law exam and failed. He totally abandoned both of his eldest son’s, and didn’t get them married or even took part in their upbringin. MGA was lazy and sat around the house and ate opium all day, like the son of most rich punjabi’s in that era.
His 4th argument
He writes: 

“…and he did not pay Zakat because he did not meet the nisab requirement. However, Hazrat
Walida sahiba [wife of the Promised Messiah (as)] gave Zakat on her jewellery”

This clearly shows that Zakat was obligatory upon his wife and she paid the due amount that was assessed upon her assets. I find it daft that Mr. AFC chooses to accept half the narration where it states that the Promised Messiah (as) does not pay Zakat but does not accept the other half of the statement where it explains why he didn’t. This is flawed thinking and an inconsistent argument to infer.

Answer: Firstly, he doesn’t give any reference here. What jewelry did his wife have anyways? At the time of marriage, MGA didn’t give her any jewelry, in fact, Ahmadi women complained about her lavish lifestyle at Qadian, you need the reference? Secondly, this proves that MGA never paid any Zakat. I have never paid it either, since it can only be paid to an islamic government, not a non-profit corporation.
His 5th argument
He writes: 

“”””””””””The Promised Messiah (as) devoted his entire life to the service of Islam. What higher sacrifice is there? What weight is there to an allegation by a common man who accuses someone who devoted his whole life for the cause of Islam. The Promised Messiah (as) followed in the footsteps of his Master the Holy Prophet (saw) and lead a life of simplicity and humility. He did not desire wealth or fame, rather he would spend in his wealth for the poor when needed. If we look at early life we see that he used to take care of the poor out of his own pocket. “While Ahmad (as) was at Sialkot, he used to entertain the poor and look after them and, as a result of this, whatever he earned did not meet all his expenses. His father used, therefore, to send him regular amounts” (Life of Ahmad (as), pg 52-53s)””””””””””

Answer: Again, he is ignorant, the majority of MGA’s life was dedicated to worldly pursuits, even then, he took money from the Ahl-e-Hadith Muslims of North india to write 50 volumes, 300 arguments in support of Islam, however, he lied, BA 1-2 were only announcements and MGA begging for money, 3-4 contain MGA’s revelations, for which he was called a Kafir by how own Ahl-e-Hadith people, the only person who supported him was the Batalvi, since he was his childhood friend. By 1904, MGA told his followers that if they don’t pay him something, he would ex-communicate them.
His 6th argument
He writes: 

“”””””””””he earned on helping the poor so much so that his own expenses and needs were not met and he would borrow from his father.”””””””””””””

Answer: this is a lie, with no references attached, MGA never borrowed money from his father.  
His 7th argument
He writes:

“”””Mr. AFC himself admits that only state taxes are mandatory payments in Islam and everything else is optional. Then why does he complains that the Promised Messiah (as) never gave money to any Islamic organization in British India as if it were a mandatory obligation. Why are you raising this accusation if its not a mandatory payment?””””

Answer: I am only pointing out the fact, see, you comprehension level is low.  I need for you to agree.
His 8th argument
He writes: 

“”””As I stated before, The Promised Messiah (as) devoted his life to the service of Islam, which
includes AND exceeds monetary donations for the cause of Islam.”””””

Answer: This is not true…MGA lived off of his daddy’s pension until he was in his late 20’s, that pension money was tax monies collected by the British government, thus haraam. Even in 1878, he asked for donations for the Braheen and promised 50 volumes and 300 arguments, and then didn’t do what he had promised.  He then brings up Batalvi and the comments that Batalvi made, Batalvi was a Wahabi, a fellow Ahl-e-Hadith mullah, MGA was fast friends with all the Ahl-e-Hadith Muslims, in fact, his wife was one, and most of his early followers like Noorduin were Wahabi aka Ahle Hadith.
His 9th argument
He writes:

“””””The Promised Messiah (as) forced his followers to pay him heavily”””””

Answer: But the quote that you presented is from 1890, when MGA barely had 100 followers. After 1900, MGA changed and threatened his followers, see here:

(Al-Hakm, March 21, 1905)

“This money was given to me by God. I shall not return it to anyone – not even a penny, as I am not accountable to anyone. Anyone who asks me to render account should not give me anything in the future.”

MGA also said
“It is the duty of all my followers to remit some amount out of their earnings. After this announcement, we shall wait for three months. We shall remove from the list of devotees the name of anyone who does not remit a portion of his earnings during these three months.
His 10th argument
He writes:

He discusses Zakat in Chapter 2

Answer: all of these requests by Allah only happened as Muhammad (saw) was the General and dictator of Medina, hence, all of these monies were given to the government of Muhammad (Saw), not a non-profit organization, and they were used for the Battle of Badr. 

Links and Related Essay’s

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Mirza Ghulam Ahmad and collecting money from interest for religion

It is unclear what MGA wrote “in-total” on the topic of interest in Islam. However, we have found a few references. In 1898, he told his disciple Seth Ghulam Nabi that it is OK to use money received from interest towards religion. MGA also comments on Zakat, which he himself never paid in his whole life. In fact, MGA claims that Muslims in India weren’t paying any Zakat either, hence proving that Zakat is only given to a Muslim government.

1898, in April, MGA issued an edict for his disciple, Ghulam Nabi Seithi Sahib who was a merchant. 

“I am hopeful that considering your good intentions and fear of the Divine, Allah the Almighty shall Himself create a way out of this situation. Until that time, observe istighfar with patience and in my opinion, there is a more preferable way to manage the interest money, and that is, do not use the money gained from the interest in your business but instead set it aside and when you have to give interest, you can give it from that [interest] money. And if you feel that some additional money is piling up, then there is no harm to spend that money for a religious cause which does not involve someone’s personal benefit, but rather it only involves the promulgation of religion.

“I have previously issued this edict for the members of my Jamaat, that the interest which has been termed unlawful by Allah the Almighty is that which is used for the personal benefit of man. The unlawful way is that a person spends interest money to run their household or spend it on food, clothing and to maintain a roof over their head or lend it to someone else with the intention that they may spend it for food or clothing.

“On the other hand, by no means it is unlawful for one to spend the interest money, without taking an iota for the personal benefit, in the cause of Allah the Almighty for the promulgation of religion. The Holy Quran establishes this fact that Allah the Almighty is the Master of all things and everything that advances towards Him gets purified, except for that money which is taken without the consent of people i.e. by theft, stealth or ransacking, as these possessions are not in any way worthy of being spent for the cause of Allah and religion. But as for that money which is collected by mutual understanding, it may be spent in the way of Allah the Almighty’s religion. It is worth reflecting how much money is needed to contest that material which is being published by the opponents in refutation of our beliefs. It is as though a war is being carried out with them, so there is no harm to spend that [interest] money to aid this war. This is the edict that I have issued …

“By no means do I suggest here that for spending interest money for the promulgation of religion, someone should intentionally become part of such an occupation [which involves interest]. Instead, the idea is that if someone is compelled, as in your case, or inherits interest money by chance, only then may this money be spent in the way that I have explained. Moreover, [the person who spends interest money for the cause of religion in this manner] would be worthy of reward.” (Sirat-ul-Mahdi, Vol. 1, pp. 402-403)

(Al Badr, 24 August 1904, p. 8)

“I cannot give an edict in favour of it [interest]. It is forbidden by all means. A type of interest is permissible in Islam and that is while lending money to someone, one does not place a precondition of any sort and the one in debt, acknowledging the favour, willingly gives an additional sum while returning the loan. This was the practice of the Holy Prophetsa. If he ever borrowed ten rupees, he would give up to hundred rupees while returning the loan (Sahih al-Bukhari, Kitab al-Musakat). The only interest which is prohibited is the one in which an agreement is made and a condition is set in advance.” 


MGA gave an edict in light of the following verse of the Holy Quran:

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِيْنَ آمَنُوْا لَا تَأْكُلُوا الرِّبَا أَضْعَافًا مُّضَاعَفَةً

“O ye who believe! Devour not interest involving multiple additions” (Surah Al-e-Imran, Ch.3: V.131). It is quite clear from this verse that Allah the Almighty forbids mankind from consuming interest i.e. to use it for worldly needs and requirements.

The word “devour” does not mean that only consumption of food and drink from interest money is forbidden, while to purchase clothes and other such items is permissible, but in fact, it has been used metaphorically for those things that are a necessity for mankind.

“This is indeed our belief and Allah the Almighty has guided me through divine inspiration that this [interest] money should be spent in the promulgation of religion. It is certainly true that interest is prohibited but this [prohibition] is for one’s own self. Anything that becomes part of Allah the Almighty’s possession can no longer remain unlawful because the concept of unlawfulness of things relates to mankind and does not concern Allah the Almighty. Interest is surely unlawful for one’s own self, family, associates, relatives and neighbours. However, if this money (of interest) is purely spent for the promulgation of religion, then there is no harm in that. Especially in the given circumstances when Islam is in a state of complete helplessness and when people unfortunately do not offer Zakat.

“I perceive that in the present times, there are two befalling calamities and two unlawful things are being considered lawful. Firstly, Zakat which was an obligation is not being offered and secondly, the taking of interest is being practiced even though it was prohibited. That is to say, the due portion of Allah the Almighty was not offered, while on the other hand, a share was taken which was not rightfully theirs. When such is the condition and Islam is in a state of terrifying weakness, I issue this verdict that the money of interest gained from the banks should at once be spent in the promulgation of religion.

“This edict which I have issued is not a general one because dealing of interest is unlawful, but in these times when Islam is in a state of helplessness, the means of economic progress have not been established and Muslims are not paying heed, spending this money for the cause of Islam is not unlawful.

“In accordance with the meaning of the Holy Quran, the unlawful thing is that the [interest] money is spent on one’s own self. One must take into account this fact that as interest is wrong for one’s own self, in the same way it is wrong to give interest to someone else as well. Surely, it is right to submit this money to the possession of Allah the Almighty and to dedicate this money only to be spent for the propagation of Islam.

“If Jihad, for instance, is being carried out and the ammunition happens to be in the possession of a transgressor and a wrongdoer, in these circumstances if one holds back [from Jihad], considering that ammunition to be unlawful, it is wrong. Instead, it would be appropriate to utilise that ammunition. At present, the Jihad of the sword has come to an end and Allah the Almighty has blessed us with a government that has granted us every kind of religious freedom. Now, Jihad of the pen remains. Therefore, it is permissible to spend [interest money] for the promulgation of Islam.” (Al Hakam, 24 September 1905, p. 9)

(Al Badr, 6 February 1908, p. 7)

“These are the ways in which people want to open the doors to that which is prohibited, so that they may do what they please. I have never said that it is permissible to receive interest money from the bank and to use it in desperate times. I only said that it was not prohibited to use it for the propagation of Islam and for other requirements of Islam. This will be so until money remains unavailable for the support of Islam and it continues to remain poor, because nothing is unlawful for Allah.

“As for personal, national or commercial requirements, it is outright forbidden to use interest for these things. The justification I have put forward is that, for instance, it is unlawful according to the Shariah to burn another living being (Sahih al-Bukhari, Kitab al-Jihad Wa Al-Siyar), but at the same time it is permissible for a Muslim to use a gun or a cannon when faced with war in this age, because the enemy too uses the same weapon.”

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Mirza Maghfoor Ahmad explains how young Ahmadi’s in America are leaving Ahmadiyya at an alarming rate

Ahmadi’s who are born in the USA are leaving Ahmadiyya at an alarming rate. Without the persecution-card, Ahmadiyya is dead! The persecution is self-generated anyways. Nevertheless, in the concluding speech at the 2019 USA-Jalsa, the younger brother of the Khalifa, Mirza Maghfoor Ahmad explains how Ahmadi’s have given up on the Ahmadiyya Jamaat in the USA. Read our reddit forum posting herein. It should be noted that Mirza Maghfoor Ahmad was only made in-charge of the USA jamaat since he is the brother of the Khalifa, not based on any merit. Mirza Maghfoor Ahmad doesn’t think that any Ahmadi’s in the USA are sacrificing their wealth, he seems to spit on Ahmadi’s who think they are sacrificing. He lies and claims that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad invented the Chanda that Ahmadi’s are having to pay in 2020, however, that is a lie, MGA never invented Chanda-Aam, MGA invented Wasiyyat, which is 10% and totally optional.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________Some highlights from this speech

—-only 30% of Ahmadi’s in the USA are praying 5 times per day alone, the stats for congregational prayers would be roughly 5%.
—-Lajna is also similar
—33% of earning members of the USA jamaat are paying 84% of all the Chanda collected in the USA, the majority (67%) aren’t paying much.
—Wasiyyat is down 1% from 2018 to 2019, in 2004, Mirza Masroor Ahmad wanted more and more Ahmadi’s to join Wasiyyat, he wanted 50% of Ahmadi’s in the whole world to become regular contributors at 10%, however, this never happened, the USA-jamaat has 29% of its members giving at least 10%, in fact, it has dropped a fraction of a point.
—He claims that Ahmadi’s in the USA love MONEY for than Ahmadiyya
—Ahmadi youth in the USA is increasingly tasting alcohol, and drugs
—Ahmadi girls are taking off their Hijaab’s at an alarming rate
—Ahmadi boys are marrying non-Ahmadi girls at an alarming rate, and fake converting them to Ahmadiyya
—Ahmadi girls are sitting at home, single and unemployed
—The divorce rate in American-Ahmadis is at 22%, and desi parents (Ahmadi’s) keep being intolerant towards their daughter-in-laws.
—The grandsons/granddaughters and great grandsons/granddaughters of Ahmadi pioneers are walking away from Ahmadiyya at an alarming rate
—Ahmadi’s keep fighting amongst each other on trivial matters
—Educated Ahmadi kids don’t care about Ahmadiyya

“Ahmadi youth is increasingly drinking alcohol and experimenting with drugs”(13:56).

“Hijab is going down at a faster rate than nasiratt joining lajna” (14:24).

“A chilling fact, how many boys are marrying outside to non-ahmadis, and our daughters are sitting home, waiting… and waiting”(14:55).

“Our grandparents and great grandparents converted and sacraficed so much for ahmadiyya, they would never imagine that 3 generations their ancestors are walking away” (16:36).

“Our participation is so low 50-60% of ahmadis don’t pray.” (18:38)

The data
If you go 10:50 into US Jamaat president’s Jalsa 2019 speech he’ll say that those who don’t pay chanda will be kicked out of the jamaat. I feel like this is a quality of a cult, the whole “pay us or you’re being banished” mentality really shows that. It’s also important to mention that at least in my local jamaat chanda seems to be what is talked about 70% of the time, which gives off bad vibes.

Also, about two months ago during a jummah i went to (still in high school, my parents make me go) it was announced that a young woman who was a member of our local Jamaat had been kicked out because she had married a non ahmadi. Again, cultish. “If you marry someone who isn’t one of us you’re banished.” Also, in the same speech at 14:50 the US President shames ahmadi boys who marry non ahmadis.

I’m in this period in my life where i’m coming to terms with the fact that I grew up in a community like Ahmadiyya, a cult like culture that played a big role in my childhood. These two factors are only two of many things wrong with the jamaat that I feel like I was in a way brainwashed into overlooking.

“”O Well to do people of Islam! I convey to you the message that you should assist this
Institution of reform, which has been established by Allah Almighty, with all your heart,
attention and sincerity. You must consider all the aspects of this institution with reverence and do quickly whatever you can do to help it. Whoever wishes to offer an amount each month,
according to his means, should make it binding upon himself like a debt, and make his
payment each month without fail. He should take this duty purely as an obligation to Allah,
and should not be late or slow in its payment. He who wishes to pay all at once can do so,
but remember that the true method which will ensure the continuous progress of this
movement is that people, who truly care about the faith, should make it binding upon
themselves to pay a certain amount each month which they can give with ease and
regularity, unless they are faced with unexpected circumstances. Of course, whoever has the
means and the resources to give something, apart from his monthly pledge, is welcome to do so.”

“O you my dear ones, my loved ones, the evergreen branches of the tree of my being! O ye who
have, by the grace of the Almighty which is upon you, entered into Ba‘iat of allegiance with me!
O ye who sacrifice your lives, your comfort and your wealth in this cause! I know that you
consider it an honour to accept whatever I say, and will not hesitate as far as it is in your power,
but I cannot make compulsory for you with my own tongue the service you have to offer, so
that your services should be out of your own pleasure and not as an obligation from me….”
(Fath-e-Islam, Ruhani Khazai, Volume 3, p. 33-34)

In 1905, MGA said:
(Al-Hakm, March 21, 1905)

“This money was given to me by God. I shall not return it to anyone – not even a penny, as I am not accountable to anyone. Anyone who asks me to render account should not give me anything in the future.”

MGA also said
“It is the duty of all my followers to remit some amount out of their earnings. After this announcement, we shall wait for three months. We shall remove from the list of devotees the name of anyone who does not remit a portion of his earnings during these three months.”

1936, the 2nd Khalifa said: 
—-“I am not a merchant to keep accounts with me nor am I a treasurer of the community to be asked to render account. I am God’s vicegerent on earth. It is not proper to ask me where I spent the money. Those are truly the believers who gift me their money and afterwards do not question me. It is all the same whether they understand or not. They understand that an objection of this sort will result in the bankruptcy of their faith.”
(Published in Al-Fadl, Sept. 19, 1936)

—-“The ‘Heavenly Graveyard’ is such a central point of this movement and an institution or department of such dimensions that it excels in importance all other departments.”
(Al-Fadl, Vol. 24, No. 65, Sept. 15, 1936)

1938, the Khalifa said: 
“Once a man from Luhdiana said that we sent donations to Qadian after bearing hardships and misfortunes. These amounts are spent on ornaments and dresses of the wife of Ghulam Ahmad. So what is the use of these donations? When this news reached his holiness, the Promised Messiah, he said it is unlawful for him to send anything to us after what he has said. Then, we shall see what harm it does to us.”
(Al-Fadl, August 31, 1938)

Links and Related Essay’s

The Mirza family demands complete obedience from all Ahmadi’s

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The British Government created the Indian Air Training Course (IAT) in Qadian at the T.I. College in the 1940’s

After the outbreak of WW-2, the British government became desperate and began making more and more Indian’s as officers. As we all know, there was an “Ahmady-only” company and Ahmadi’s were trusted more than any other group of non-whites. The British were so desperate, the Japanese had taken Burma, and many other British colonies in the Far East and they wanted India next. Being an Ahmadi was almost like a certificate that would surely get an Indian person preferential treatment. In fact, even Zia Ul Haq joined Ahmadiyya in 1941. This is an interview of Chaudhary Muhammad Ali who was living in Qadian at that time and attending the T.I. College.

The British wanted Ahmadi’s to become pilots in the British Air Force
The British government spent lots of money here in Qadian. Chaudhary Muhammad Ali (a hard core qadiani) tells us that the College in Qadian in the 1940’s was the only college in all of India to have high technology Aircraft simulators and etc. They also had 2 small aircraft there in Qaidan, one un-assembled and one as fully assembled. The Sadr-Anjuman at Qadian had even purchased a few planes for themselves (see at the 21:00 minute mark). This is probably why Bashir Ahmad Orchard converted to Ahmadiyya, since he saw their amazing relationship with the British government. Spate drew a map of Qadian and mentioned how a crashed aircraft torso was being used at Qadian for training purposes.

In 1974, Bhutto starting removing Ahmadi Generals and other high ranking Ahmadi officers
This caused Ahmadi’s to hate Bhutto and to eventually prop up Zia Ul Haq to execute Bhutto.

This is a golden era in Ahmadiyya history, they were re-instated into government and military positions. Specifically, in 1982, there is a list of Ahmadi’s which proved over-representation of Ahmadi’s in civil jobs.

By 1987, Ahmadi’s were generals again
It seems that Zia began promoting Ahmadi’s again, he was never against Ahmadi’s in the first place.

Famous Ahmadi officer’s who almost made General
Major Syed Maqbool Ahmad was a colleague of Zia and one of the founders of ISI.

Nasir Ahmad Faruqi (a Lahori-Ahmadi)
He was the principal secretary for Ayub Khan from 1959 to 1969 as well as Chief Election Commissioner of Pakistan for the 1965 election, which was totally rigged. The elections in Pakistan were under his control in 1970 also.

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Click to access charles-kennedy-paper.pdf

Hazrat Mirza Nasir Ahmad

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Ahmadiyya Social Boycott Circular in India–2020

There is absolutely NO Ahmadiyya persecution in India. There has never been. During the partition, many Ahmadi’s were killed in and around Qadian. Nevertheless, since 1947, the government of India considers Ahmadi’s as Muslims and has allowed them to keep Qadian at barely 5-7% of the population. We have recently found an announcement which was given to all Indian jamaat’s of the Ahmadiyya Movement wherein it is ordered to socially boycott Ex-Ahmadi’s. Even in the USA, in 2010, Ahmadi’s were kicked out for attending a wedding wherein there was dancing.

The Data

Ahmadis often (not always) deny the fact that their community issues call for social boycotting and shames the people who don’t comply with orders of the Khalifa/Nizam-e-Jamaat. To compile evidence for such cases, u/ReasononFaith recently started a thread here. In this regard, I’d like to share a circular from last year that was shared with all the Ahmadiyya Masjids in India and was read out 3 times during Friday sermons.

Here’s the original circular:

Post image

I don’t understand Urdu, but the circular was translated to my local language. So from that, I am giving you a rough English translation of the first point:

Post image

The injunction to leave the weddings upon seeing an excommunicated member is especially given to Jama’at office bearers. But the instruction to not invite excommunicated members to social functions or going to their’s seems to be a general command and it is enforced as such. Moreover, most of the local Masjids here in my place have an average of around 40-50 members including Khadims, Lajna & Ansar. We all know there are official positions in each of these branches, thus around 60-70% of all reasonably active Jama’at members would be an office-bearer.

And the final point is interesting. Only family members may participate in an excommunicated member’s wedding with prior permission. Do you see how ridiculous this can get?

For example: Let’s assume I am an excommunicated member. My cousin, who’s still an Ahmadi is getting married within Ahmadiyya itself. No worries there. But for my cousin to invite me who’s living one block away, to his wedding, should get the permission of Mirza Masroor Ahmad in London (since the circular bans inviting excommunicated members to social functions). So with permission (granted only because I am family), my cousin invites me to the wedding. And I go to the wedding. At the wedding, one of the office-bearers who’s not a relative of my cousin sees me, he realizes I am an excommunicated member, so as per the instruction of the above circular he should leave the wedding immediately! Yes, that ridiculous is the instruction of the circular!

What are some common reasons for getting excommunicated from the Jama’at?

The major reason for ex-communication is related to marriage. If you being an Ahmadi girl marries a non-Ahmadi guy without fake converting him, you are ex-communicated. If you are an Ahmadi boy and marries a non-Ahmadi girl without prior permission, you are out! But for boys sometimes they are allowed to marry non-Ahmadi Muslim girl, with prior permission ofc.

Ex-communication can happen for other reasons too. For example, a few members from India were excommunicated for doing a Multi-Level Marketing Business in India. I am personally against MLM, but the company they were working for was doing legal business in India and their business model wasn’t an unIslamic perse. But Jamaat banned it and ex-communicated people who did that after one warning. Remember, even if an Ahmadi argues they were excommunicated because the business model was unIslamic, one should wonder how many Ahmadis were excommunicated for using interests in their business? But that’s another topic for discussion.

But people are *not* excommunicated generally for other things like consuming alcohol, using interest, fraud, etc. There might be cases, but that’s not a general thing.

In short, the most common way of getting excommunicated from Ahmadiyya is when an Ahmadi marries someone outside the community, and when some Ahmadis go and participate in those weddings.

(I heard once a family was excommunicated because they did not have strict gender segregation in their wedding. I am not sure of this, but it seems something that can happen)

Did Jama’at excommunicate anyone for participating in a marriage or was this an empty threat?

Yes, they did. There were plenty of people who were excommunicated for participating in the marriage of other excommunicated people. Once excommunicated, they are required to write a letter to Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad Khalifatul Masih Al Khamis Ayyadallahu Ta’la Bi Nazril Azeez himself seeking forgiveness for their grave error. Then wait for a few days and they’ll get his reply forgiving them. This is simply a power play, to keep people in line, to make them realize at the end of the day Khalifa is still the boss. One person, I personally know, is rich and contributed possibly millions to Ahmadiyya and to this day he financially helps countless Ahmadi families. He’s very humble and friendly even to the poorest. Being such a guy he once went to a wedding which was banned by the Jamaat. He had to go because the family members (not just the Ahmadi side, but also the family of the groom who was non-Ahmadi Muslims) were so very close to him. And guess what? He was excommunicated for this! This just one case. Dozens of ex-communications happened for merely participating in weddings.

Remember, when excommunicating a member, their names are publicly announced during the Friday sermon. This causes shame not only to them but also to their close family. This contributes to the shaming culture within the Jamaat to a great extent.

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Mirza Ghulam Ahmad said that men have been bestowed greater faculties than women

MGA was supposed to be a reformer, however, he failed. Desi men are still sick, twisted, backwards, and generally lazy.  However, the remarks that MGA made about women are really bad. MGA basically said that men and women are not equal, he also said that men have been bestowed greater faculties than women, and women are less courageous than man, and women are the root of idolatry. MGA also said that women should unquestionably loyal to their husbands. MGA also said that men should never even hear women’s voices, which means no music from those female indian singers. In 1933, the Khalifa said that women shouldn’t work. The Mirza family always saw working women as a sort of curse. Even in 2020, women are not allowed to vote in general–local elections for Jamaat President and etc. Mirza Tahir Ahmad and Mirza Masroor Ahmad told Ahmadis that it’s OK to beat their wives and to force Hijaab.  

The Quote
[Malfuzat, vol. 7, pp. 133-34](Via Essence of Islam, vol. 3, page 324

 “””””If you desire to reform your own selves, it is essential that you also seek to reform your women. Women are the root of idol worship, for they are naturally devoted to decoration and ornaments. This is why idolatry started with women. They are also less courageous. Under the
slightest stress of hardship, they begin to cringe before their fellow creatures. Hence those who are completely under the influence of their women gradually acquire their characteristics. It is, therefore, necessary to constantly try to reform them. God Almighty says: 

‘Men are guardians over women.’—Al-Nisa’, 4:35

This is why men have been bestowed greater faculties than women. One marvels at the modern man who insists on the equality of the sexes and asserts that men and women have equal rights. Let these people raise armies of women and send them into battle and see the result for themselves. How would a pregnant woman discharge her duties in the battlefield? In short, women have fewer and weaker faculties than men. Men should, therefore, keep them under their care.”””””””””


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In 1884, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad claimed that the Quran 48:29 was also revealed to him

After the publishing of the 4th volume of Braheen e Ahmadiyya in late 1884, MGA was called a Kafir by the leaders of the Ahl-e-hadith sect, who had just helped MGA marry an Ahl-e-Hadith girl. MGA was so bold, he began claiming that many verses of the Quran had been also revealed onto himself. In this essay, we are writing about 48:29, which would be 48:30 in the Ahmadiyya Quran’s (interestingly, after MGA died, the Ahmadi’s who wrote commentary on the Quran never mention that this verse is about MGA, Lahori’s and Qadiani’s, see page 2953)). Per MGA,  “””I have been named ‘Muhammad’ as well as ‘Messenger'”””, (see “Eik Ghalti Ka Izala”, page 2, online english edition). MGA is essentially claiming HE WAS REFERRED TO AS MUHAMMAD in this verse.

In Nov. of 1901, in MGA’s famous announcement/booklet, “Eik Ghalti Ka Izala”, MGA says:

“”””””””””””””””””””””In the same book, close upon the above Divine Communication, is this Divine revelation:  Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and those who are with him are
hard against the disbelievers, tender amongst themselves.“”””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””

This is just the first sentence of the full verse from the Quran
The full verse is as follows:

“”””””””””””””””””””””””Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah. And those who are with him are hard against the disbelievers, tender among themselves. Thou seest them bowing and prostrating themselves in Prayer, seeking grace from Allah and His pleasure. Their mark is upon their faces, being the traces of prostrations. This is their description in the Torah. And their description in the Gospel is like unto a seed-produce that sends forth its sprout, then makes it strong; it then becomes thick, and stands firm on its stem, delighting the sowers — that He may cause the disbelievers to burn with rage at the sight of them. Allah has promised, unto those of them who believe and do good works, forgiveness and a great reward.“””””””””””””””””””””””””””

The verse is mentioned in Izala Auham (1890–1891) as MGA tried to explain his abusive language
As MGA worked on explaining as to why he had used abusive language, he quoted 48:29.

This verse was on the cover page of Asmani Faisala (1891)
The verse was presented on the cover page of MGA’s famous book.

Other Quranic verses that MGA claimed for himself in 1884
——48:28, 61:09 and 9:32


In Barahin-i-Ahmadiyya Vol. 4, online english edition, page 396
The original quote can be found in english.

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In 1884, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad claimed that the Quran 61:09, 48:28 and 9:32 was also revealed to him

After the publishing of the 4th volume of Braheen e Ahmadiyya in late 1884, MGA was called a Kafir by the leaders of the Ahl-e-hadith sect, who had just helped MGA marry an Ahl-e-Hadith girl. MGA was so bold, he began claiming that many verses of the Quran had been also revealed onto himself.

48:28, 61:09 and 9:32 in “Eik Ghalti Ka Izala” 1901
On the second page, MGA quotes a revelation of his which is similar to three verses of the Quran, 48:28, 61:09 and 9:32 (that would 48:29, 61:10 and 9:33 in Ahmadiyya Quran’s). MGA never specified the verse number, we have to assume all 3 were revealed to him.

MGA says:

“””Even in Brahin-e-Ahmadiyya, which was published some 22 years ago, these words appear in no small number. For instance, one of the Revelations found in Brahine- Ahmadiyya reads:

“”””””””””””””””””””””””””””””He it is Who has sent His Messenger, with guidance and the Religion of truth, that He may make it prevail over all other religions.”””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””

(See Brahin-e-Ahmadiyya, p. 498)(See also “Eik Ghalti Ka Izala”, online english edition)

48:28, 61:09 and 9:32 in Braheen e Ahmadiyya Vol. 4
The exact same reference is on page 374. The Ahmadiyya editor’s erroneously listed it as verse 61:10, it would be 61:09 in the non-Ahmadi Quranic numbering system. 9:32 is another similar verse. In fact, 61:09, 48:28 and 9:32 are all almost identical to each other. MGA even claimed that these verses were prophecies about his own coming. See page 379 also, the first part of the 3 verses is quoted by MGA.

The reference from the 2009 online english edition of Tadhkirah
See page 92.

61:09 (61:10 in the Ahmadiyya Quran’s) is quoted in Khutbah Ilhamiya
Interestingly enough, the same verse is quoted by MGA in Khutbah Ilhamiya.

Other Quranic verses that MGA claimed for himself in 1884
——48:28, 61:09 and 9:32

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Zia Ul Haq’s grandson speaks

Zia ul Haq seems to have came from an Ahmadi family. Nevertheless, his grandson seems to have written about him in 2014.

His essay

Published: August 16, 2014
The writer is based in Princeton, New Jersey. He tweets @mziaadnan

The writer is based in Princeton, New Jersey. He tweets @mziaadnan

The writer is based in Princeton, New Jersey. He tweets @mziaadnanThe writer is a London-based student who has contributed to The Express Tribune Blogs and Pakistan Today.

I can only come up with the forewarning that this is not a reactionary outburst, nor in support or defence of the merits of military governments in place of genuine democracy, if we can ever come to that. Yes, former president Ziaul Haq is my grandfather, and if this article appears to you as one-sided, and no doubt it certainly will, perhaps, we should first question our overzealous political anchors and their self-crowned analyst guests, who repeatedly present the same side of the coin.

26 years after the C-130 crash, I decided to pick up Benazir Bhutto’s much-lauded 1988 memoir, Daughter of the East. Initially apprehensive given that Benazir begins with her father’s execution, I had prepared myself for the barrage of criticism that would be directed towards General Zia. Three chapters in, however, I found myself laughing at the baseless accusations that Bhutto levels against Zia and his family.

Regarding the former president’s funeral, Benazir claims that in order to increase participation, the government paid for the accommodation of citizens in Islamabad. In reference to Shahnawaz Bhutto’s funeral, Benazir describes the feeling of tremendous sadness that swept over Sindh, and how millions turned up to mourn ‘martyr Bhutto’s’ son. The videos of the 1988 state funeral are online, and while Shahnawaz’s untimely and mysterious death (which his niece Fatima claims was Benazir’s doing) may have attracted many supporters, there is no comparison to the two to three million individuals who descended upon Faisal Masjid from all across Pakistan. The Mohtarma’s memoir is replete with the downplaying of the facts which reveal the support Zia had from Pakistanis.

Then there is the absolutely absurd claim that General Zia planned to flee to Saudi Arabia after Benazir’s return in 1986. She writes, “Zia allegedly left with his family, three airline containers of furniture, and a gold-plated Rolls Royce gifted to the president from an Arab head of state.” I’d certainly like to know where the car is, because we, Zia’s family, definitely don’t have it; perhaps it, along with the ‘furniture’, has made its way to Surrey, or better yet, the underground garage of a certain someone’s Park Lane apartment.

In order to understand the extent of the damage that Bhutto, both father and daughter, caused to Pakistan, one has to dig deeper. Yet, our media is inclined toward the superficial, remaining on the surface during attempts to dissect the characters of General Zia and Bhutto — a moustached general who came to power through martial law doesn’t look as good to them as an idealistic prime minister with a feudal background swaying the masses with his romantic notions of roti, kapra and makaan.

If power doesn’t change hands, and only changes faces, which Fatima Bhutto once said in a Karan Thapar interview, then Benazir, behind her dupatta and coiffed hair, was about as much a dictator as General Zia. A January 1995 Amnesty International report titled Pakistan: The Pattern Persists outlines the human rights promises made by the PPP, and how the government instead facilitated the spread of torture and rape by the “widespread practice of incommunicado detention, sometimes in places not officially designated as prisons.” There was also Operation Clean-up or Blue Fox, which under Bhutto’s initiation turned Karachi into a hotbed for sectarian violence that continues to this day.

On the much-decried issue of General Zia’s censorship, let’s not forget Junoon’s song Ehtesaab, parodying fat cat bureaucrats and politicians as well as the infamous poly pony stables at PM House, which was banned from being aired on PTV under Benazir’s premiership. Najam Sethi said it best in the 1996 exposé, Princess and the Playboy, when he told viewers that Bhutto forgot to be an elected leader and instead became a queen. The irony lies in her repeated reference to herself as Cory Aquino, and General Zia in the same category as Ferdinand, the Shah and other tyrants. In hindsight, it seems that she was less Aquino and more Imelda.

More recently, however, under the government of former president Zia’s biggest mistake, the media has launched a campaign of defaming his character under the guise of political satire. The July 31 episode of Express News’s Media Azaad Hai parodied Ziaul Haq in extremely bad taste: if the media is truly as ‘azaad’ as it says it is, then perhaps it should also poke fun at the former prime minister’s late father in primetime.

It’s almost funny how political programmes across networks repeatedly mention former president Ziaul Haq in every single episode. Why? Because General Zia sells books, because General Zia gets ratings up, because General Zia is forever etched into our selective national memory.

We never fled the country, never got whisked away by a sympathetic Middle Eastern despot. President Zia did not run any political party like a family business either. He did not pass on the mantle of power to his son, or spouse, or sibling in a system akin to monarchy. It is today’s politicians who think they can loot and plunder Pakistan’s exchequer, manipulate the mandate from the people, and then cry foul in remembrance of the dictators that sent them into the wilderness of exile (Kensington, Jeddah, Dubai). This is ‘democracy’ in Pakistan, and General Zia is its most convenient target.

Published in The Express Tribune, August 16th, 2014.

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